一套没有家具装饰 很干净就像医院一样
First, a set decorated without furniture. It's clean, like a hospital,
墙上挂着十字架 传达一种神秘主义的感觉
with crosses on the wall to convey a sense of mysticism.
只有基本的东西 比如神圣的仪式
There are only essential objects, like a sacred ceremony.
主人的衣服遮住了他的脸 他像穆罕默德一样掩面
The master's outfit conceals his face. He hides his face, like Mohammed.
他是一个本质的存在 没有自我
He is an essential being, without ego.
这些是日本茶道的实际动作
These are the actual movements of a Japanese tea ceremony.
所有的动作都是有意识的
All the movements are conscious.
亚历杭德罗乔多洛夫斯基 那仍然是我的名字
Alejandro Jodorowsky. That is still my name.
我失去了它的一部分
I have lost pieces of it.
我的全名是亚历杭德罗·佐多罗夫斯基·普鲁兰斯基
My full name was Alejandro Jodorowsky Prullansky.
普鲁兰斯基是我母亲的名字 但太长了
Prullansky was the name of my mother, but it was too long.
真糟糕 我忘了我母亲的名字了
It's too bad, I have lost the name of my mother.
只有我父亲的名字占上风
Only my father's name has prevailed.
我很乐意记录这些评论
I'm very happy to record these commentaries
因为圣山对我来说是一次伟大的冒险
because The Holy Mountain was a great adventure for me.
我是在另一种生活中拍摄这部电影的
I shot this film in a different life.
我不再是以前的我了
I am not the same man anymore.
在这些评论中 我将尝试复活一个不再存在的亚历杭德罗
In these commentaries, I'll try to resurrect an Alejandro that no longer exists.
我会竭尽全力让他回到现在
I will make a concerted effort to bring him back to the present,
因为我喜欢年轻时的我
because I like the young man that I once was.
他竭尽全力想拍一部神圣的电影
He was trying with all his soul to make a sacred film.
他想用他的电影改变人类
He wanted to change mankind with his films.
他认为电影比迷幻药好
He thought that cinema was better than LSD.
他认为他的电影会给观众带来启发
He thought his film would be a source of enlightenment for the audience.
我是第一个把指甲涂成黑色的演员
I am the first actor who painted his fingernails black.
后来许多摇滚界的人复制了它
Many people in rock later copied it.
这两个女孩不是女演员 他们想要一次精神上的体验
These two girls weren't actresses. They wanted to have a spiritual experience.
他们在寻找自己的真理 赤裸裸的真理
They were searching for their own truth, their naked truth.
以圆圈开启的内在上帝
The inner God that opens in circles
朝向更大的意识
toward a greater consciousness.
一颗向更大的意识开放的心
A heart that opens toward a greater consciousness.
箭必须射中的目标
The target that the arrow must hit.
佛之眼
The eye of Buddha.
珍珠 那必须打磨的灵魂
The pearl, the soul that must be polished.
当门打开时 人们发现了三部曲的钥匙
When the door is opened, a key is found to the trilogy.
现在 到阴间去
Now, descend into the world of the dead,
到无梦的世界
to the world of dreamless dreams.
下降
Descending...
蝴蝶翅膀象征着蜕变
Butterfly wings symbolize metamorphosis.
穿过蛇 昆达里尼
Back up through the serpent, Kundalini...
爱神的珍珠
...the pearls of Eros,
直到它到达一个几何图形 那就是内在意识
until it arrives at a geometric figure, which is the interior consciousness.
他是塔罗牌中的傻瓜 躺在地上
He's "The Fool" of the tarot, lying on the ground.
他的脸上满是苍蝇 象征着无用的想法
His face is covered with flies, symbolizing useless thoughts.
他在自己身上小便
He is urinating on himself.
他迷了路 喝醉了
He's lost and drunk.
这张牌代表了他 塔罗牌的傻瓜牌
This is the card that defines him, the tarot's Fool card.
傻瓜总是以一种动物为代表 那就是他的自我
The Fool is always represented by an animal that is his ego.
青蛙就是自我
The frog is the ego.
这种性格是愚人神圣的一面
This character is the divine aspect of The Fool.
这些男孩的生殖器都被涂成了绿色
These boys have their genitals painted green.
他把长在手上的花像根一样拔了出来
He pulls out the flower that grows on his hand like a root
并形成基督的伤口
and forms the wound of Christ.
孩子们带着他去看摇摇欲坠的埃及金字塔
The boys take him over a crumbling Egyptian pyramid,
象征着一个古老的文明
symbolizing an ancient civilization.
用驴腿 他勾画出一条线 一个极限
With a donkey's leg, he traces a line, a limit.
他们扔石头来唤醒被钉在十字架上的基督
They throw stones to wake Christ, who is on a cross,
塔罗牌上的T
on a "T", the "T" of tarot.
他终于醒了 开始漫长的入会仪式
He finally wakes up to begin the long initiation
那会给他智慧
that will give him wisdom.
他摒弃了他的童年 他的原始主义
He shoos away his childhood, his primitivism.
他暴露了他的愤怒 他的本能
He uncovers his rage, his basic instincts.
他想攻击这个唤醒他的生物
He wants to attack this being that has woken him.
但他通过恶行得到了安抚 和我抽一点大麻
But he is placated through vice - "Smoke a little joint with me."
他就是这样驯服他的
And that's how he tames him.
这部电影中的每个角色都有一个占星符号
Every character in this film has an astrological symbol.
没有胳膊的人耳朵里有个月亮
The man with no arms has a moon in his ear.
沉睡的人开始理解人类的情感
The sleeping man begins to understand human emotions.
他找到了与自己的友谊 与他邪恶的一面
He finds friendship with himself - with his monstrous side.
他们继续吸毒 兴高采烈 酩酊大醉 庆祝
They carry on taking their drugs, happy and drunk, celebrating.
但我们在独裁统治下 学生被杀害
But we're in a dictatorship, where students are killed
成百上千的人被钉在十字架上 富人却在谈论宗教
and hundreds are crucified, while the rich speak of religion
并且自我感觉良好
and feel good about themselves.
这些尸体是我从餐厅借来的
I borrowed these carcasses from a restaurant.
后来我把它们还回去时 顾客们把它们吃了
When I returned them later, the customers ate them.
扮演美国游客的是大卫·卡帕拉利克
The man who plays the American tourist is David Kapralik,
这是美国著名歌手希尔和斯通家族的经纪人
the agent for Sly & The Family Stone, a famous American singer.
这个美国人不担心政治局势
This American doesn't worry about the political situation.
看这里
Watch the birdie!
他们在强奸他的妻子 他觉得这很有趣
They're raping his wife, which he finds very amusing.
这是非常有趣的 他的电影
It's very entertaining. He films it.
这指的是美国精神 对海外发生的事情漠不关心
This refers to the American spirit, oblivious to what's going on overseas.
即使在今天 美国人也不知道他们在国外做过什么
Even today, Americans don't know what they have done abroad.
非美国人不是存在 他们是旅游的一部分
Non-Americans are not beings, they're aspects of tourism.
他给了他一美元 因为他让他拍了它
He gives him a dollar for having let him film it.
蟾蜍与变色龙马戏团
我们的性格是学习金钱的价值
Our character is learning the value of money.
现在他在蟾蜍和变色龙马戏团工作
Now he works in the "Toad and Chameleon" circus,
指的是征服美洲
which refers to the conquest of America.
他们雇用这个人物为他们的马戏团做广告
They hire the character to advertise their circus.
他现在喜欢钱了
He likes money now.
他成了金钱的帮凶
He's become an accomplice to money.
今天 墨西哥的征服
他宣布这个由蟾蜍和变色龙组成的节目
He announces this show made with toads and chameleons,
这些衣服太难穿了
which were so hard to dress!
他们的尿液像酸一样
Their urine was like acid.
当我穿上他们的盔甲 他们就会充满空气
When I put on their armor, they'd fill up with air,
然后他们会炸了它 然后试图逃跑
then they would blow it out and try to escape.
变色龙穿着阿兹特克人的服装
The chameleons were dressed in Aztec outfits.
所有的符号都是阿兹特克符号
All the symbols are Aztec symbols.
我们等了很久 直到变色龙伸出舌头或移动眼睛
We had to wait ages until a chameleon stuck out its tongue or moved its eyes.
他们不会移动
They wouldn't move.
他们的一举一动都是珍宝 我发誓
Every move they make is a treasure, I swear.
看 它要动了
Look, here it's going to move.
我想说 移动 动 移动 他在那儿动了 看见了吗
I'd say, "Move! Move! Move!" There he moved, see?
这个头饰是伟大的皇帝蒙特祖玛的仿制品
This headdress is a copy of Montezuma's, the great Emperor.
克里斯托弗·哥伦布的三艘船到达了这里
Here Christopher Columbus's three ships arrive.
第一个下船的人是一个牧师 他会让所有人皈依
The first person off the ship is a priest who would convert everyone.
然后是纳粹 德国人 我用了瓦格纳的一首歌
And then come the Nazis, the Germans. I used a song by Wagner.
我选择蟾蜍是因为它们很柔软
I chose toads because they were soft...
还有变色龙 因为它们是那么不动 那么完美
...and chameleons because they were so immobile, so perfect.
好戏来了
And here comes the drama.
大屠杀开始了 屠杀 种族灭绝
The bloodbath begins. The slaughter, the genocide,
借口是必须实施法律
under the pretext that the law must be imposed.
这项法律对这些人来说是陌生的
It's a law that is alien to these people.
这就像把民主强加给阿兹特克人
It's like imposing democracy on the Aztecs.
这对他们有什么用
What use is it to them?
我在街上拍下了这一幕 周围的路人都惊呆了
I filmed this on the street, among astounded passers-by.
我们的性格是受金钱驱使的 这是另一个 在数钱
Our character was driven by money. Here's the other one, counting money.
他开始感到痛苦 因为他觉得自己像一只癞蛤蟆
He starts to suffer, because he feels like one of the toads.
公众对演出很满意 但他却哭了
The public is satisfied with the show, but he cries.
他意识到自己被毁灭了
He realizes he has been destroyed.
基督出售
这里出售的是基督 宗教已经变成了一种生意
Here Christ is for sale. Religion has become a business.
这里我开始引用各种电影
Here I start making references to various films.
比如意大利电影
Italian films, for instance,
那些探索圣经主题的大型作品
those huge productions that explored biblical themes.
游客们仍然不明白
The tourists still don't understand.
她把圣心戴在生殖器上
She wears the Sacred Heart on her genitals.
他买了一个十字架 它很重 所以他们给了他一些帮助
He buys a cross. It's very heavy, so they give him some help.
我觉得那三个士兵和那个打扮成圣母玛利亚的胖子很滑稽
I find those three soldiers and the fat guy dressed as the Virgin Mary very funny.
Come on, have something to drink with us. Come on, drink with us.
快点 快过来
跟我们一起喝点东西
快点 跟我们一起喝
Drink it, drink it...
喝了它 喝了它 喝了它
他们引诱他是因为他长得像基督
They seduce him because he looks like Christ.
他们想复制基督的形象 这就是这一幕的意义所在
They want to reproduce Christ's image. That's what this scene is about.
他离开了他的朋友 最后却背叛了他
He leaves his friend, he ends up betraying him.
换句话说 他背叛了自己的一部分
In other words, he betrays a part of himself.
猪身上的油脂象征着自我 他们用它盖住他
The grease of the pig symbolizes the ego. They cover him with it.
与光学效果相比 现实效果好多少
How much better is reality, compared to an optical effect?
这里他通过两根管子呼吸 所以他没事
Here he is breathing through two tubes, so he's alright.
这是我自己版本的米开朗基罗的拉皮埃塔
This is my own version of Michelangelo's La Pietà,
米开朗基罗的著名雕塑 圣母抱着死去的基督
Michelangelo's famous sculpture in which the Virgin holds the dead Christ.
龙舌兰酒奎尔沃博士 奎尔沃的意思是乌鸦 是炼金术中的主要物质
Tequila Cuervo. Cuervo means "raven", which is the primary matter in alchemy.
庙里的商人睡着了 他醒了
The merchants of the temple are asleep, and he wakes up.
他会有另一个顿悟的时刻
He will have another moment of enlightenment.
他意识到自己被用来扮演基督的角色
He realizes he's been used to play the role of Christ.
这是他最深刻的领悟时刻
This is his most profound moment of insight.
我给小偷的声音起了个绰号 是我在尖叫
I dubbed the thief's voice. It was me who was screaming.
这是基督将商人赶出圣殿的隐喻
This is a metaphor for Christ chasing the merchants out of the temple.
这是圣经中的形象 他摧毁了虚假的自我
It's a biblical image. He destroys his fake egos.
这不是我 这不是我
"This isn't me! This isn't me!"
然后他发现了一个很像他的雕塑
And then he finds a sculpture that really looks like him.
这就是我想要的
"This is what I want to be.
这就是我想要的 这就是我想成为的基督
"This is what I want to be. This is the Christ I want to be."
教堂里的妓女
The prostitutes in the church.
其中一个有只猴子 她那毛茸茸的自负
One of them has a monkey - her hairy ego.
我不想和演员合作
I didn't want to work with actors.
我想与真人合作 扮演与自己相似的角色
I wanted to work with real people playing characters similar to themselves,
因为我想做的第一件事就是帮助演员们进步
because the first thing I wanted to do was to help the actors evolve.
为了改变世界 我必须改变电影中的演员
In order to change the world I had to change the actors in the film.
我想 我要和真实的人一起工作 启发他们
I thought, "I will work with real people and enlighten them."
我没有给演员任何指示 我只是告诉他们 四处走动
I didn't give the actors any directions. I just told them, "Move around."
我叫他们走开 但我没有给他们指明方向
I asked them to move, but I didn't give them directions
因为他们在扮演自己
because they were playing themselves.
我们即将看到的场景象征着变态
The scene we are about to see symbolizes perversion,
这个世界的变态恋童癖
the pedophilic perversion of this world.
这个可怜的小女孩在出卖自己
This poor little girl is selling herself.
这个角色获得了尊严 他在寻找自己
The character has gained dignity. He is searching for himself.
他找到了他的使徒 他们既是妓女又是使徒
He finds his apostles, who are whores and apostles at the same time.
这个人看到了他内心的基督并爱上了他
This one sees the Christ within him and falls in love.
她爱上的不是人 而是精神上的人
She doesn't fall in love with a human being, but with a spiritual one.
她看到了他的灵性
She sees his spirituality.
她治愈了他的创伤 这也是她的创伤
She heals his wounds, which are also her wounds.
她是富有同情心
She is compassionate.
她敬畏他 把他当作自己的主人
She reveres him and takes him as her master.
他们来到了一场男人们与男人们跳舞的舞会前
They arrive at a dance where men are dancing with men.
我们看到士兵和平民跳舞
We see soldiers dancing with civilians.
我那时就知道平民会在战争中丧生
I already knew back then that civilians get killed in wars.
于是 我加入了士兵和平民的行列 跳起了爱的舞蹈
So, I joined soldiers and civilians together in a dance of love.
平民是没有穿制服的士兵
A civilian is a soldier without a uniform.
士兵是穿制服的平民 他们是平等的
A soldier is a civilian wearing a uniform. They're equals.
在这个场景中 一个疯狂的查罗把枪插进我的胸膛说
In this scene, a crazy charro stuck a gun into my chest and said,
别拍了 不然我杀了你
"Stop filming or I'll kill you."
我发疯了 侮辱了他 我说如果你杀了我 我就杀了你
I went insane and insulted him. And I said, "If you kill me, I'll kill you."
我对他大吼大叫 他害怕了就走了
I yelled at him, he got scared and left.
但我在这场戏中冒了生命危险
But I risked my life in this scene.
那个墨西哥人差点杀了我
That Mexican could have killed me.
我最受威胁的地方是墨西哥
The place where I was threatened the most was Mexico.
在拍摄期间他们想要我死 教会出版了一本反对我的书
During the shoot they wanted me dead, the Church published a book against me.
内政部长打电话给我说
The Minister of the Interior called me and said,
总统真的很喜欢你
"The President really likes you,
但我们收到了很多抱怨 不要在电影里放制服
"but we've had a lot of complaints. Don't put uniforms in the film.
没有神父 没有士兵 没有消防员 把这些都去掉
"No priests, no soldiers, no firefighters. Take all that out
因为政府对你很好 但它可能会变得很危险
"because the Government is being good to you, but it could become dangerous."
这几乎是对我生命的直接威胁
It was almost a direct threat to my life.
第二天 我带着所有的录像离开了墨西哥 来到了纽约
The next day I left Mexico with all the footage and came to New York.
我在这里完成了圣山
I finished The Holy Mountain here.
墨西哥是一个迷人的国家 因为他们喜欢黑人英雄
Mexico is a fascinating country because they like black heroes.
他们攻击他们的英雄 但如果你坚守阵地
They attack their heroes, but if you stand your ground,
后来他们羡慕你 爱你
later they admire and love you.
牧师用一种虚构的语言对他喊叫
The priest yells at him in a made-up language.
这不是真的 这个赤裸的基督 把他从这里带走
"This isn't true, this naked Christ! Get him away from here."
他意识到在那个教堂里他们已经失去了基督教的真正意义
He realizes that in that church they have lost the true meaning of Christianity.
他通过吃脸来领受圣餐
And he holds communion by eating the face.
图像就是我
"The image is me."
这是他进化的又一步
This is another step forward in his evolution.
他想要提升到精神上的发展
He wants to ascend toward spiritual development,
它的象征是天空
which is symbolized by the sky.
阴和阳
Yin and Yang.
善于接受和主动的人
The receptive and the active.
当他飘向天空时 原始世界就结束了
The primitive world ends when he floats toward the sky.
现在电影的第二部分开始了
Now the second part of the film begins.
第一部分描述了原始世界
The first part described the primitive world.
现在我们进入神秘的世界
Now we go toward the mystical world.
他们都抬头看 好像在等什么东西从天上掉下来
They are all looking up, as if waiting for something to fall from the sky.
他们现在还在这么做 他们只吃鱼和葡萄
They are still doing it. They only eat fish and grapes,
这是基督教的象征
which are Christian symbols.
他们在一群等候的人中间到达
They arrive in the middle of a crowd of waiting people.
他们在等什么
What are they waiting for?
有一个塔顶有个洞 一个钩子下来
There is a tower with a hole at the top, and a hook descends.
钩子上有一个带有太阳符号的袋子
On the hook there is a pouch with a solar symbol.
袋子里装着金子
The pouch contains gold.
他上钩了 被他对金钱的渴望所驱使
He gets on the hook and, driven by his desire for money,
这是他唯一知道的事 他上了塔
which is the only thing he knows, he goes up the tower.
它是一个入会塔 连接着天地
It is an initiation tower, a link between Heaven and Earth.
他决心要偷窃
He is determined to steal.
他是个小偷 他要去偷金子
He is a thief. He's going to steal the gold.
他上当了 有时候 我们内心的上帝会给我们下套
He's taken the bait. Sometimes our inner God casts bait for us.
他说 我就在这里 在你体内 来找我 认出我来
He says, "I'm right here, inside you. Come look for me. Recognize me.
我就是你 你就是我
"I am you and you are me.
接触你神圣的一面
"Get in touch with your divine side."
我越看这部电影 就越注意到里面的塔罗牌符号
The more I watch this film, the more I notice the tarot symbols in it.
例如 塔是第16张牌
The Tower, for example, is card 16.
那些情人 那些傻瓜 几乎所有的塔罗牌人物都出现在这部电影里
The Lovers, the Fool... Almost all the tarot characters are in this film.
现在他进入了一个子宫
Now he enters a sort of womb.
在它的尽头有一个处女膜 他必须打破它才能
At the end of it there is a hymen that he must break
为了跨过门槛 从一个世界进入另一个世界
in order to pass through the threshold, to pass from one world to another.
他就要进入魔法世界了
He's about to enter the magical world.
原始世界与魔法世界汇合
The primitive world converges with the magical world.
他认为这非常难 但不需要花太多的力气就能通过
He thinks it's very tough, but it doesn't take much to get through.
如果你下定决心 进入另一个世界是很容易的
It's easy to enter another world if you set your mind to it.
你必须跳入虚空
You must jump into the void.
这里我们看到了彩虹 一个形状像彩虹的房间
And here we see the rainbow, a room shaped like the rainbow.
他走向光明 走向意识
He walks toward the light, toward awareness.
他发现了一个充满象征的世界
He finds a world of symbols.
骆驼穿越沙漠 阴和阳
A camel for crossing the desert, Yin and Yang.
用言语表达灵魂 是落在精神上的一滴
The soul with words, the drop that falls on the spirit.
道 耶和华的杖
The Tao, the rod of Jehovah,
卡巴拉 水星的象征
the Kabbalah, the symbol of Mercury.
那个黑人女人身上的纹身是我自己想出来的
The tattoos on the black woman are something I came up with myself
现在我到处都能看到他们
and now I see them everywhere.
这是九型人格的大师 一个由九个符号组成的系统
Here's the master of the enneagram - a system of nine symbols.
火成岩是火的象征
Igneous is the symbol of fire.
我对弗兰肯斯坦的鞋子印象深刻
I was impressed by Frankenstein's shoes,
所以我问我的设计师尼基
so I asked my designer, Nicky,
不仅有高跟鞋 还有厚底鞋
to come up with shoes that not only had heels, but high platforms as well.
骆驼做了一个伟大的工作
The camel did a great job.
我认识的一个动物园管理员把动物借给了我们
A zookeeper I knew lent us the animals.
我们晚上用卡车把它们运出去 然后再把它们还回去
We'd take them out at night in a truck and then we'd return them.
他就像一只被困在蜘蛛网里的苍蝇
He's like a fly trapped in a spider's web.
但他们不会杀了他 他们会给他真实的生活 他将会重生
But instead of killing him, they will give him true life. He will be reborn.
脉轮
The chakras.
他再一次触动了自己的心 他的思想也开放了
He touches his heart again, and his mind opens up.
现在他们要铲除他的过去
Now they are going to eradicate his past.
他的肿瘤是他的过去 它将被移除
That tumor he has is his past and it will be removed.
我把血的颜色改成了蓝色
I changed the color of the blood and made it blue.
这是我能找到的最能代表肿瘤的东西
The best thing I could find to represent the tumor
是我在市场上买的一只章鱼
was an octopus that I bought in the market.
过去已被抹去
The past has been removed.
现在是脉轮 他会重生的
Now the chakras, and he'll be reborn.
他把武器给了他 这把刀现在没用了
He gives him the weapon. The knife is useless now.
这是一把十字形的刀
It's a cross-shaped knife.
这是他的镜像 他们有同样的声音
This is his mirror image. They have the same voice.
你想要金子吗
Do you want gold?
是的
Yes.
当我决定制作圣山时
When I decided to make The Holy Mountain,
艾伦·克莱因把我介绍给了甲壳虫乐队 包括乔治·哈里森
Allen Klein introduced me to The Beatles, including George Harrison.
乔治·哈里森读了剧本 非常喜欢
George Harrison read the script and loved it.
他约我在纽约的广场酒店见面
He asked to meet me in the Plaza Hotel, here in New York,
讨论我们将如何制作这部电影
to discuss how we would make the film.
我到达的时候当然很高兴
I arrived quite happy, of course.
他说他愿意拍整部电影 只留下一场
He said he was willing to do the entire film except for one scene.
哪一个 -小偷赤身裸体的那一幕
- "Which one?" - "The scene where the thief is nude
在浴室里炼金术士在镜头前洗他的肛门
"in a bathroom and the alchemist washes his anus in front the camera."
他说我不愿意露出我的肛门
He said, "I'm not willing to show my anus."
我说 你必须这么做
I said, "You have to.
这不仅仅是一部电影 它会改变人们的想法
"This isn't just a film, this will change people's minds.
你会提供一个很好的放下自我的例子
"You'll provide a wonderful example of leaving your ego behind."
不 我不能 他回答
"No, I can't," he replied.
所以 我说 很不幸 我不能删掉这一幕
So, I said, "Well, unfortunately, I cannot take out this scene."
他决定不这么做 我回到了墨西哥
And he decided not to do it. I went back to Mexico,
把这个角色给了一个不知名的演员
gave the role to this unknown actor
损失了数百万美元
and lost millions of dollars.
但当时那是我 我拍电影不是为了赚钱或成名
But at the time that was me. I didn't make films to earn money or fame.
我造它们是为了改变人类 这是真相
I made them to change mankind. That's the truth.
鹈鹕是基督的象征之一
The pelican is one of the symbols of Christ
因为据说当他们的孩子饿了的时候
because it is said that when their babies are hungry
鹈鹕啄自己的胸膛 用自己的血喂自己
pelicans peck at their own chest to feed them with their blood.
他用的是Tefillin 一种犹太圣物
He uses the Tefillin, which are Jewish sacred objects,
因为炼金术和卡巴拉有犹太根源
because alchemy and Kabbalah have Jewish roots.
在精神分析
In psychoanalysis,
孩子们的粪便被认为是一种创造性的东西
excrement by children is considered something creative.
在精神分析学中 粪便和黄金是一回事
Excrement and gold amount to the same thing in psychoanalysis.
根据弗洛伊德的理论 最大的罪是出生
According to Freud, the greatest sin is to be born.
他说 当你出生时 你创造了一个想成为宇宙的自我
He said, "When you're born, you create an ego that wants to be the Universe.
它想成为上帝 但不能成为
"It wants to be God, but can't be."
他认为我们出生是有罪的
He thought we were guilty of being born
还有成为一切的雄心壮志
and of having this great ambition of being everything.
按照佛陀的说法
In a similar way, according to Buddha,
除了年老 疾病和死亡
apart from old age, illness, and death,
人生最大的悲剧是出生 出生就是进入痛苦
the greatest tragedy is to be born. To be born is to enter pain.
他想把自己从重生的枷锁中解放出来
He wanted to free himself from the chains of being born and reborn.
该死的 他们都错了
Damn! They're both wrong!
我反对精神分析和佛教 停止它
I am against psychoanalysis and against Buddhism. Stop it!
能出生真是太好了
It's wonderful to be born!
生病是美好的 因为病成了你的主人
It's wonderful to be ill, because the illness becomes your master.
变老是一件美妙的事情 因为它会让你变得更聪明
It's wonderful to grow old, because it makes you wiser.
死亡是一件美妙的事 因为永生是如此无聊
And it is wonderful to die, because being immortal would be so boring!
他会把粪便变成金子
He will transform the excrement into gold.
他将把这个原始的人变成一个门徒
He will transform this primitive being into a disciple.
了解我们所有的负面特征是非常重要的
It is very important to know that all of our negative traits
可以成为积极的品质 有助于我们的发展
can become positive attributes and contribute to our development.
你是秽物
You are excrement. You can change yourself into gold.
你可以把自己变成金子
一个椭圆形的镜子 他尴尬地看着自己
An oval mirror. He looks at himself and is embarrassed.
当他打破镜子时 他进入了一个充满镜子的世界
When he breaks the mirror, he enters a world full of mirrors.
立方体上方的金字塔是共济会的形象
The pyramid above the cube is a Masonic image.
他们称之为凿石 -
They call it "working the stone" -
利用自我来达到本质
working the ego to get to the essence.
你打碎了镜子
You broke the looking glass. Now break the stone.
现在把石头打碎
他打不开石头 因为他太努力了 他野心勃勃
He can't break the stone because he's trying too hard, he's ambitious.
如果你野心勃勃 渴望得到的东西 你是不会得到的
If you are ambitious and desire things, you will not get them.
大师没有野心 一击 石头就开了
The master has no ambition. One hit and the stone opens.
每个石头都有灵魂
Each stone has a soul,
只是对顶部的一击
Just one blow to the top...
数百万年的工作形成的
formed by the work of millions of years.
有透明的意识
There lies transparent awareness.
塔罗牌会教你如何创造一个灵魂
The tarot will teach you how to create a soul.
我们要进行一场塔罗牌入会仪式
We're going to enter a tarot initiation session.
我很小的时候就开始学习塔罗牌
I started studying the tarot when I was very young,
当我23岁的时候
when I was 23 years old.
从那以后 我一直在研究它 试图理解它的意义
I've been studying it and trying to understand its meaning ever since.
塔罗牌是一种视觉语言 一种符号百科全书
The tarot is a visual language, an encyclopedia of symbols.
一旦我记住了它 理解了它 并且能够使用它
Once I memorized it, understood it, and was able to use it,
一旦我成为了一个塔罗牌大师 我对世界的看法就改变了
once I became a tarot master, my perception of the world changed.
我开始以不同的方式感知世界 开始用符号思考
I started to perceive the world differently and to think in symbols.
我们看到的塔罗牌图像是我发明的
The tarot images we are seeing were invented by me.
我不该那么做的 我应该用真枪的
I shouldn't have done that. I should have used the real ones.
但那时我是一个自命不凡的艺术家 我相信我能超越它
But back then I was a pretentious artist and believed I could outdo it.
马赛塔罗牌是一件神圣的作品
The tarot of Marseille is a sacred piece of work.
要理解它 你所能做的最好的不是去创造一个新的
The best you can do to understand it is not to create a new one,
而是利用已经存在的
but to use the one that already exists.
在神圣的艺术中 完美是这样定义的
In sacred art, perfection is defined like this -
没有什么要添加 也没有什么要删除
there's nothing to add and nothing to remove.
当我做圣山我不太明白塔罗牌
When I did The Holy Mountain I didn't quite understand the tarot.
我想创造自己的塔罗牌
I tried to create my own tarot.
这些就是塔罗牌的元素 人类的四个组成部分
These are the elements of the tarot - the four components of a human being.
首先是魔杖 象征着性
First of all, the wand, which symbolizes sex.
创意性
Creative sex.
去了解
To know.
剑 为智慧 从性 走向精神 走向头脑
The sword, for intellect. From sex, toward the spirit, toward the head.
去挑战
To dare.
杯 为心
The cup, for the heart.
去渴求
To want.
最后是黄金 物质生活上升直到它成为光环
And finally, the gold. The material life rising until it becomes an aura.
去沉默
To be silent.
这些动作是我的禅师创造的
The movements were created by my Zen master,
秃鹰用以攫住牛的力量
The same force the vulture uses to seize the ox
Ejo Takata 墨西哥
Ejo Takata, in Mexico.
也同样被牛用来承受秃鹰
is needed by the ox to receive the vulture.
我还雇了一位在美国工作的大师
I also hired a master who worked in the States.
他创建了一个名为阿里卡培训的组织
He had created a group called Arica Training.
他来墨西哥教我如何成为大师
He came to Mexico to teach me how to be a master.
他来到了墨西哥 给了我迷幻药 指引了我八个小时
He came to Mexico, gave me LSD and guided me for eight hours.
奥斯卡·伊卡佐 来自阿里卡培训
Oscar Ichazo, from Arica Training.
我以前从未吸过毒 以为他会训练我锻炼身体
I had never done drugs before and thought he'd train me with exercises.
他告诉我 不要浪费时间 吃点迷幻药就行了
He told me, "Don't waste your time. Just have some LSD."
我就是这么做的
And that's what I did.
他来自玻利维亚 来自古里耶夫传统
He was from Bolivia and came from the Guryev tradition.
他教我们九型人格 我在这部电影里用的
He taught us the enneagram, which I used in this film.
有九个字
There are nine characters.
鱼在想着他的饥饿
The fish thinks about his hunger, not about the fisherman.
而不是渔夫
是大师在寻找门徒
It is the master who seeks the disciple.
有一只白孔雀 象征着觉悟
There is a white peacock, a symbol of enlightenment.
你想要知道那个秘密
You want to know the secret,
但人只凭自己无法获得任何成就
but man can achieve nothing by himself.
为了完成炼金术 你会有这些同伴
To accomplish the alchemical work, you will have these companions.
他们是像你一样的贼
我电影里的角色说话时从不动嘴
The characters in my films never move their mouths when they speak.
They are thieves like you, but on another level.
但是在另一个水平上
他们是星球上最强大的人
They are the most powerful people on the planet.
这是一部电影 为什么他们要动他们的嘴
It's a film, so why should they move their mouths?
企业家和政治家
Industrialists and politicians.
我的名字是弗恩
My name is Fon, my planet is Venus.
我的星球是金星
这是电影中唯一一个真正的演员 尽管他在电视台工作
This was the only real actor in the film, although he worked in television.
我生意专注于
My business is devoted to the comfort and beauty of the human body -
人类身体的舒适和美丽
这是我在一个真实的工厂里拍摄的 是我改造的
I filmed this in a real factory, which I converted.
床
beds, mattresses, fabrics,
床垫
布料
衣服
clothing, cosmetics.
每个角色都代表其行星的负面
Each character represents the negative side of their planets.
化妆品
这是维纳斯 所以他有很多妻子和孩子
This one is Venus, and so he has many wives and children.
他只关心美貌和自恋
He is concerned with beauty and narcissism.
根据希腊人的说法 爱神是一位女性 但这位却是一位男性
According to the Greeks, the god of love was a woman, but this one is a man.
我父亲是这个帝国的创造者
My father is the creator of this empire.
他既聋又哑又瞎
He is deaf, dumb and blind.
这一切还有一个政治意义
There is also a political meaning to all of this.
政治是我们这个世界的一个元素 但并不是一切都是政治的
Politics are an element of our world, but not everything is political.
在做出决定之前
Before making a decision, he consults with my mother's mummy.
他要跟我妈妈的木乃伊商量
他把他的手放进她的生殖器
He puts his hand into her sex.
如果是潮湿的 就是同意
If it's moist, it's yes. If it's dry, it's no.
在这个世界上 并不是每件事都与政治有关
In this world not everything is political.
如果是干燥的 就是否定
但如果我想给出一个全面的概述 这是我不能忽视的一部分
But it's a part I couldn't ignore if I wanted to give a comprehensive overview.
这些是我的妻子
These are my wives.
我只在工作时间和她们做爱
I make love to them only during working hours.
有宗教方面的 有政治方面的
There is a religious side, a political side,
她们开始是工人
They begin as workers, then I promote them to secretaries.
神秘的一面 炼金术的一面 艺术的一面
a mystic side, an alchemic side, an artistic side.
然后我把她们晋升为秘书
所有这些都存在于生活中
All of this exists in life.
这是博比 来自旧金山的风骚女郎
This is Bobby, from the San Francisco "Coquettes".
他是我见过的最漂亮的异装癖者
He was the most beautiful transvestite I had met.
他后来变成了女人 他是个变性人
He became a woman later, he's a transsexual.
她成了主要的情人 精子是由小心脏组成的
She becomes the primary lover. The sperm is made of little hearts.
老板的精子是由小心脏组成的 这是非常浪漫的 我爱它
The boss's sperm is made of little hearts. It's very romantic. I love it.
我总是想知道艺术的目的是什么
I always wonder what the purpose of art is.
艺术家是社会上的小丑吗
Are artists the jesters of society?
这有点像抽烟 人们吸烟是为了消遣
It's a bit like smoking. People smoke to enjoy themselves,
但这是一种致命的娱乐
but it is an entertainment that kills.
当你去看电影时
When you go to the cinema
却被当作12岁的孩子对待
and are treated like a twelve-year-old child,
祝你玩得愉快
you have a good time,
但你每次都显得更蠢
but you come out more stupid each time.
电影让观众变傻了
Cinema is making audiences stupid,
而是像对待婴儿一样对待他们
it's treating them like babies.
我不想那么做 我想唤醒人们
I didn't want to do that. I wanted to wake people up.
我想唤醒一个自中世纪以来就病了的社会
I wanted to wake up a society that has been ill since the Middle Ages.
我必须制作愈合的胶片
I must make films that heal.
艺术是好的 当它治愈 当它治疗
Art is good when it heals, when it's therapeutic.
我希望我的电影能对人们产生情感上的影响
I wanted my films to have an emotional impact on people,
我们知道人们想要被爱
We know that people want to be loved,
不为他们是怎样的人
not for who they are but for what they appear to be.
引起无意识的反应
to cause an unconscious reaction,
而为他们的外表是怎样
这样人们离开剧院时就会焕然一新 充满新的活力
so people would leave the theater changed, charged with a new energy,
所以我们创造了很多面具
So we have created a line of masks,
有肌理
that have the texture, warmth, and smell,
温暖
用一些启示 用一些东西
with some revelation, with something.
和活人的气味
of living human beings.
它必须不仅仅是娱乐 之后你会觉得自己像个傻孩子
It had to be more than just entertainment, after which you feel like a stupid child.
顾客可以有任何她想要的脸
A customer can have any face she wants.
每一张脸都独一无二 并且能保持一生
Every face is unique and lasts a lifetime.
这是面部强化手术
We see here a facial enhancement operation,
她能戴着人造脸进入坟墓
She can wear her artificial face to the grave.
它们现在很常见
they are very common these days.
我们的化妆部为尸体除去死亡的痕迹
Our make-up department for corpses eliminates the appearance of death.
我们不仅做漂亮的死尸
Not only do we beautify cadavers,
我们还给他们安装电子设备
we also equip them with electronic devices.
他们可以和家人吻别
They can kiss their family goodbye...
不久的将来 死者将能够说话
Someday soon the dead will be able to speak.
我们给他们机器 他们会动他们的嘴说
We'll give them machines and they'll move their mouths and say,
参加他们自己最后的仪式
...participate in their own last rites...
再见 我的孩子 否则他们会保佑我们 就像这位
"Goodbye, my children." Or they will bless us, like this one here.
或者提供一个现场表演
...or give a live show.
这是一个女同性恋演员
This is a lesbian actress.
我的名字是艾丝拉
My name is Isla, my planet is Mars.
我的星球是火星
在这里我将讨论同性恋问题
Here I address gay issues.
我谈到了同性恋问题 以及战争问题
I addressed homosexual problems, as well as those of war.
因为 这是火星
Because... this is Mars.
背景里有一幅法国画
There's a French painting in the background.
一个女人抓住另一个女人的乳头 它有一种女同性恋的感觉
A woman grabs another woman's nipple. It has a lesbian touch.
我走近那幅画 在乳头上放了一盏闪烁的灯
I got closer to the painting and put a flashing light on the nipple.
圣山的音乐是由唐·切利和我自己创作的
The music of The Holy Mountain was composed by Don Cherry and myself.
我遇见唐·切里是因为我在寻找一位精神音乐家
I came across Don Cherry because I was looking for a spiritual musician.
我看到过这样的小丑 穿着一套零零碎碎的衣服
I saw this sort of clown, dressed in a suit made from bits and pieces.
他的妻子是瑞典人 她是一位前卫艺术家
His wife was Swedish, she was an avant-garde artist,
她所有的东西都来自纽约的垃圾箱
and all her possessions came from rubbish bins in New York,
从人们扔掉的东西中
from things that people threw away.
这些布是人们扔掉的
The pieces of cloth came from what people threw away.
因为在纽约 当人们扔掉某样东西时
Because in New York, when people got rid of something,
他们会把它放到大街上
they would just put it out on the street.
家里的家具 勺子 他们所有的东西
The furniture in their house, the spoons, everything they had
从垃圾箱里出来的 这些都是免费的
came out of rubbish bins. It was all free.
她用零零碎碎的东西给他做演出时穿的衣服
She'd make outfits out of bits and bobs for him to wear at his gigs.
他还吹了一把破喇叭
He also played a broken trumpet.
我想展示通过显微镜看到的同性恋体位
I wanted to show homosexual positions, as seen through a microscope.
每天早上我叫醒我的男秘书们
Every morning I wake up my male secretaries.
我制造和销售武器
I manufacture and sell weapons.
我在一家钢铁厂拍摄了这个场景 我被允许使用
I shot this scene in a steel factory that I was allowed to use.
我们生产轰炸机
We produce bombers, hydrogen bombs,
氢弹
雷射枪
ray guns, deadly bacteria,
我的预算很低 但我想要一部有宏大布景的宏大电影
My budget was low, but I wanted a grandiose film with grandiose sets.
致命细菌
反物质波
anti-matter waves, carcinogenic gases, etcetera.
致癌气体等等
所以 我会拍摄真实的地点 并添加一些东西 让它们有点不真实
So, I would film real locations and add something to make them a bit unreal.
人类的凶残
Human ferocity.
塔利班
The Taliban.
我们在试验一种药品
We are experimenting with a drug to create delusions of grandeur.
能创造出壮观的错觉
另一种药品能把无害的人变成野兽
Another drug turns harmless people into wild beasts.
年轻的一代需要武器来前进和示威
战争变成了摇滚
And this is war turning into rock and roll.
The young generation needs arms for its marches and sit-ins.
我很有先见之明 因为我提到了宗教战争的问题
I was prophetic because I addressed the issue of religious wars,
这将在以后发生 这是一场战争 宗教战争
which would take place later on. This is a war, a religious war.
我们有迷幻散弹枪
We have psychedelic shotguns...
起初 这只是时尚 然后我们看到了手榴弹
At first it is just fashion. Then we see the grenades.
手榴弹项链
一切都是美丽的 它是犯罪的美化
Everything is beautiful. It is the beautification of crime.
...grenade necklaces...
摇滚乐武器
...rock and roll weapons...
佛教徒 犹太教徒
...mystical weapons for Buddhists...
有佛教徒 犹太人
There are the Buddhists, the Jews...
和基督教徒的神秘武器
...Jews...
基督教天主教徒 他们都制造武器
the Christian Catholics. All of them manufacture weapons.
...and Christians.
我的名字是克伦
My name is Klen, my planet is Jupiter.
我的星球是木星
这就是百万富翁 他在现实生活中是个百万富翁
This is the millionaire. He was a millionaire in real life.
我的房子
My house.
他收藏了许多艺术品
He has an art collection.
我的妻子
My wife.
这个女人没有乳房 她把它们截掉了
This woman didn't have breasts. She had had them amputated.
那个百万富翁的妻子没有乳房
The millionaire's wife didn't have breasts.
她不是演员
She was not an actress.
如果你仔细看 你会发现她没有乳房
If you look closely, you can see she hasn't got breasts.
钢琴设备不太好用 我想让它看起来像个巨大的避孕套
The piano rig didn't work very well. I wanted it to look like a huge condom,
但这并不完全有效
but it doesn't quite work.
我的司机
My chauffeur.
司机是好莱坞著名制片人哈里·科恩的儿子
The chauffeur was the son of a famous Hollywood producer called Harry Cohen.
司机由哈里·科恩的儿子扮演
The chauffeur is played by Harry Cohen's son.
我的爱人 每周一千
- My lover. - Hi!
A thousand a week.
这是一个碰巧在附近的美国女孩
This is some American girl that just happened to be around.
她的名字叫Re
Her name was Re.
我非常喜欢这个女孩
I liked this girl very much.
我让她通过耳朵嗑药
I got her to take drugs through her ear.
没有人呢 我发明了耳朵可卡因
Nobody does that. I invented "ear cocaine".
我觉得这象征着那个自我推销的诗意女孩
I think this symbolizes the poetic girl that sells herself.
我的艺术工厂
My art factory.
我想在这里嘲笑一下现代艺术
Here I intended to poke fun at modern art.
我们每季制造一条新的艺术流水线
We produce a new line of art every season.
这是我发明的 人们用屁股画画
This is something I invented - people painting with their buttocks.
这些雕塑出自墨西哥艺术家Felguérez之手
These sculptures are by a Mexican artist called Felguérez.
我让他把人体和抽象雕塑融合在一起
I asked him to merge human bodies with abstract sculptures.
他很生气 因为他的雕塑在屏幕上没有多少时间
He got angry because his sculptures don't have much time on screen.
他没有意识到人们会在多年后看到它们
He didn't realize people would see them for years to come.
我努力工作了好几个月 你只能看到他们几秒钟
"I worked so hard for months and you only get to see them for a few seconds."
它们仍然被认为是现代艺术 它们可以放进现代艺术博物馆
They are still considered modern art. They'd fit in the Museum of Modern Art.
还没有人以一种美学的方式将人体融合
Nobody has yet merged human bodies, in an aesthetic fashion,
与抽象的雕塑
with abstract sculptures.
我们创造出一种爱的机器
We created a love machine.
要让它活动
To make it live the spectator has to work with it, guide it,
观众必须使用它 引导它
这台机器的创造是基于形而上学的概念
The creation of this machine is based on metaphysical concepts.
接受它 把自己投身于爱的行为中
receive it, give himself in the act of love.
用这个电子棒
With this electronic rod he will rub its mechanical vagina.
我想展示一个会变得越来越大的小机器
I wanted to show a small machine that would get bigger and bigger,
他能摩擦这个机器阴道
观众的技巧会决定
让人觉得这台机器正在主宰整个宇宙
to give the idea that this machine was taking over the Universe.
The skill of the spectator will determine the machine's ability to reach a climax.
机器有没有能力达到高潮
因为它给人类带来快乐
And because of the pleasure it gives to humans,
机器本身也变成了人类 产生了新的机器
the machine itself becomes human and gives birth to a new machine.
抽象艺术变成了生物学 这就是目的所在
It was abstract art turned into biology. That was the intention.
我在艺术展览中使用了同样的概念
I use the same concept in the art exhibition,
把人体和抽象形式混在一起
mixing human bodies with abstract forms.
几何形体中的人类
Humans inside geometric forms.
我想把几何学和生物学结合起来
I wanted to fuse geometry with biology.
现在日本人制造的机器人就是这样
This happens nowadays with the robots that the Japanese are creating.
我的司机是个很糟糕的爱人
My chauffeur is a bad lover.
他不知道怎么去满足它
He didn't know how to satisfy it.
但是这个女人 我很了解她的技巧
But this woman, I know her techniques very well,
我们会产生出电子高潮
will produce the electronic orgasm.
性冷淡
Frigid!
我认为人类注定要创造机器 然后将其植入自己的身体
I think man is meant to create machines that he will later insert into his body,
这将改变他的生活
and that will transform his life.
在未来 人与机器将成为一体
In the future, man and machine will be joined as one being.
这就是我的想法 或者我希望发生的事
That's what I think, or what I would like to happen.
当然 机器是危险的
Machines are dangerous, of course.
他们可以发展智力和自主性
They can develop intelligence and autonomy
创造他们自己的社会
and create their own society.
它可能发生 它可能发生
It can happen. It could happen.
有了这台机器 我用幽默来面对恐惧
With this machine, I confronted that fear with humor.
我让这台机器生孩子
I got the machine to give birth to a baby machine,
我想它最终会长大的
which will eventually grow up, I suppose.
我的名字是赛尔 我的行星是土星
My name is Sel, my planet is Saturn.
我的顾客是孩子们
My customers are children.
这是土星 这很重要 因为土星和孩子们一起玩
This is Saturn. It's very important, because Saturn plays with children,
然后吃掉它们
and then eats them.
我们在一所真正的学校里拍的
We shot this at an actual school.
这些孩子们对糖果很兴奋
These children were excited about the sweets
小矮人装扮成圣诞老人
and the dwarfs dressed up as Santa Claus.
我找不到那个跟着她的大块头 他是一个巨人
I had trouble finding that huge man that's following her. He's a giant.
这是瓦莱丽 我当时的妻子
This is Valerie, my wife at the time.
这是有白月亮和黑月亮的大象 阴和阳
Here's the elephant with the white and the black moons - Yin and Yang.
塞尔基金会
厚皮动物是非常有力的地质标志
Pachyderms are very powerful geological symbols.
塞尔玩具工厂
它们象征着大地 我没有的根
They symbolize the earth, the roots I haven't got.
除了像我这样活着 我还想像大象一样活着
Aside from living in my shoes, I'd like to live on as an elephant.
我的国家就是我的鞋子
My country is my shoes.
当我在戛纳放映圣山时
When I screened The Holy Mountain in Cannes,
电影节主席要求我在一个国家的管辖下提交这部电影
the Festival's president required that I submit the film under a country.
我说那是墨西哥的 但墨西哥不想承认那是他们的
I said that it was Mexican, but Mexico didn't want to recognize it as theirs.
那是一部太奇怪的电影 没有查罗斯 这不是墨西哥人
It was too weird a film, with no charros. It wasn't Mexican.
这一事实影响了他在电影节上获奖的机会
That fact affected the chance of winning an award at the festival.
但我不在乎 因为我不是在踢足球 我在拍电影
But I didn't care because I wasn't playing football. I was making a film.
这一幕里只有老人 我从养老院买的
In this scene there are only old people. I got them from a retirement home.
这是困难的 我得把它们从家里接回来 然后再带回去
It was hard. I had to pick them up from the home and then take them back.
他们会尿裤子 弄脏自己
They'd piss and soil themselves.
我们生产战争玩具
We manufacture war toys.
这是一家由老人经营的玩具厂
This is a toy factory run by old people.
奇怪的是 他们为孩子们做东西
They make things for children, bizarrely enough.
他们只生产武器 所有玩具都是武器
The only thing they make is weapons. All the toys are weapons.
微缩塑胶炸弹工坊需要工人
Workers needed in the miniature plastic bomb shop.
只要孩子的教育没有改变
As long as children's education doesn't change,
世界也不会改变
the world will not change either.
我们有一台电脑
We have an electronic computer
其中编入了政府的活动
programmed with the politics of the government.
政府是我们的客户
The government is our client.
他们是每个国家的国家元首
Those are the heads of state for every country.
我们向电脑输入
We feed the computer data on coming wars and revolutions.
他们正准备让孩子们堕落
They are getting ready to corrupt the children.
即将到来的战争和革命的资料
它就会告诉我们要生产什么玩具
It tells us what kind of toys to produce
来适应出生的孩子
to condition children from birth.
举例来说 如果政府计算出
For example, if the government calculates
需要发动战争来对抗秘鲁
that it will be necessary to wage war against Peru,
我们的机器就会研究秘鲁人
our machine studies the Peruvians and tells us what to do.
然后告诉我们做什么
我们制造性欲极强的褐色本地吸血鬼
We manufacture hyper-sexed brown native vampires,
只能被白皮肤颜色的十字架所毁灭
who can only be destroyed by a cross the color of white skin.
我们创造出一种放松的东西
We create a laxative that induces vomiting.
能引诱呕吐
我们以秘鲁首都来命名它
We name it after the capital of Peru and tint it with the color of the natives.
并且把它涂成当地人的颜色
我们开始了一个漫画书的活动
We started a comic book campaign.
我在这里谈到的秘鲁革命
The Peruvian revolution I talk about here
太空超级英雄 上尉队长
会在稍后的光辉之路中发生
would take place later on with The Shining Path.
这是秘鲁的一场大灾难 我预见到了
It was a catastrophe in Peru, and I foresaw it.
秘鲁的问题早在它发生之前就出现在这部影片中了
Peru's problems appeared in this film, long before they happened.
对抗秘鲁怪兽
这个世界病入膏肓
The world is very ill.
世界需要拯救海洋 河流 环境 社会和金钱
The world needs to heal the seas, the rivers, the environment, society, money.
提前了十五年
For 15 years in advance,
我们以孩子们仇恨未来敌人为条件
we condition children to hate the future enemy.
它必须自愈
It must heal itself.
我们都病了
We're all ill.
艺术家必须做出反应
The artist must react.
艺术家必须是一个医治者
The artist must be a healer.
电影一定是某种启示
Cinema must be some sort of revelation.
观众不应该认同一个通常是变态的英雄
Audiences should not identify with a hero who is generally a pervert.
詹姆斯·邦德是个变态
James Bond is a pervert.
超人是个变态
Superman is a pervert.
超人 想象他和一个女人在一起
Superman! Imagine him with a woman.
他会射精到足以摧毁她的身体
He would have an ejaculation so big that it would destroy her body,
从她的大脑中出去 摧毁一座建筑
exit through her brain and destroy a building!
超人是一种不能做爱的生物 因为他会杀了他的伴侣
Superman is a being who can't make love, because he'd kill his partner.
在十五年之内
In 15 years these children will go off to war,
这些孩子们会奔赴战场
去高兴地杀死秘鲁人
to kill Peruvians with pleasure.
我的名字是伯格
My name is Berg, my planet is Uranus.
我的星球是天王星
这个男孩是同性恋 他的名字叫尼基
This boy was a homosexual. His name was Nicky.
我在麦克斯城酒吧找到了他
I found him at the Max's City Bar.
他打扮成女人 喝醉后勾引我
He was dressed up as a woman and he seduced me when he got drunk,
因为他摘下了假发 扔在桌上 露出了一个光秃秃的脑袋
because he took off his wig, threw it on the table and revealed a bald head.
我想 这太棒了
I thought, "This is fantastic."
他是一个伟大的艺术家 帮我制作了电影的服装
He was a great artist and helped me make the costumes for the film.
这位女士 过去常在电影制片厂闲逛
This lady... used to wander the film studios
寻找兼职工作
looking for work as an extra.
我收留了她 每个人都取笑她 因为他们认为她疯了
I took her in. Everyone made fun of her because they thought she was mad.
我爱她是因为她出现时头发和阴毛都是绿色的
I loved her because she showed up with green hair and green pubic hair.
她戴着一顶阴部假发
She was wearing a pubic wig.
最有趣的是她没有肚脐 它是令人惊异的
The most fascinating thing was that she had no belly button. It was amazing.
因为我是一个神秘主义者 我立刻想到了夏娃
Because I am a mystic, I immediately thought of Eve.
夏娃没有肚脐 因为她生在亚当的肋骨上
Eve had no belly button because she was born from Adam's rib.
我喜欢建那个高高的厕所
I loved building that tall toilet.
那个窗户的大小错了 我不喜欢
Our window is the wrong size,
那是我的金玉其外的梦想 坐在马桶上晃着双腿
That's my golden dream - to sit on the toilet with my legs dangling.
I don't like it.
伯格
Berg, why do we have that enormous hole in the wall?
那是完美的 神秘的马桶
That's the perfect, mystical toilet.
为什么我们的墙上有个大洞
堵上
Close it up!
我以为粪便的力量可以产生免费的电力
I thought that the force of falling excrement could create free electricity.
如果你把马桶拉起来拉屎 大便掉下来的时候就能发电
If you raise the toilet and shit, the turds generate electricity when they fall.
如果全人类都在两米高的厕所里拉屎
If all mankind shitted from a two-meter high toilet,
我们可以得到我们想要的所有电力
we could have all the electricity we wanted.
这是宇宙之母和知识分子之间的关系
This is a relationship between the universal mother and an intellectual.
我们的小宝贝饿了
Our little baby is hungry.
这个疯狂 张扬的人物
This mad, flamboyant character
是一位研究电子学的知识分子
is an intellectual who deals with electronics,
那时候还不怎么流行
which in those days were not so much in vogue.
他是一个天才的数学家 有一个巨大的俄狄浦斯情结
He is a genius mathematician and has a tremendous Oedipus complex.
我一直在考虑天王星
I've always considered Uranus
来代表人类黑暗和堕落的一面
to represent the dark and depraved side of humans.
这就是我对天王星的看法
That's how I see Uranus.
它是所有行星中最远 最神秘 最黑暗的
It's the farthest, most mysterious and darkest of all planets.
它与宇宙深处的暗能量有关
It's related to the deep, dark energy in the Universe.
它与无意识有关
It's related to the unconscious.
我预见到了电脑和互联网的使用
I foresaw the use of computers and the Internet.
很多人问我对技术发展的看法
Many people ask me how I feel about technological developments,
关于互联网等等 比如机器人
about the Internet and so on, things like robots.
你把报告完成了吗
- Have you finished the report? - No.
没有
我认为如果我们能走到这一步 那是因为人类是为此而生的
I think that if we have got this far, it's because man was created for it.
蜘蛛结蜘蛛网 没有人觉得奇怪
Spiders make spider's webs, and nobody finds it surprising.
人类制造机器是因为这是他们大脑程序的一部分
Man makes machines because that is part of their brain programming.
机器是神圣的
Machines are sacred.
探索生命奥秘也是人类的天性
It's also in man's encoding to explore the mystery of life
总统想要报告 快点 快点
知道这是给我们的信息
and to know that there is a message for us.
The president wants the report. Hurry up! Hurry!
我们只知道宇宙中百分之一的物质
We only know one percent of the matter in the Universe.
我们必须探索和创造生命 这是积极的
We must explore and create life. It's something positive.
但这也是一把双刃剑
But it is also a double-edged sword.
互联网使世界变得全球化
The Internet has globalized the world,
但它可能会成为一个全球独裁国家
but it could become a global dictatorship.
我是总统的金融顾问
I am financial adviser to the president.
这些东西很危险
These things are dangerous,
但是人类的发展什么时候不是危险的呢
but when hasn't human development been dangerous?
一切都是危险的
Everything is dangerous,
但是人类将会向前发展 因为我们有三个重要的使命
but mankind will move forward, because we have three essential missions -
第一 了解整个宇宙
number one, to know the whole Universe,
第二 要想和宇宙一样长时间存在
secondly, to survive for as long as the Universe does,
为了拯救这个国家的经济
To save the country's economy,
第三 我们必须成为宇宙的良知
and thirdly, we must become the Universe's conscience.
我们一定要在以后的五年内
we must eliminate four million citizens in the next five years.
除去四百万个居民
这是其中一位制作人 他带着30万走了 我们再也没见过他
This is one of the producers. He left with $300,000 and we never saw him again.
开始行动 建造毒气室
Begin the operations of the gas chambers,
然后是毒气学校 毒气大学
gas schools, gas universities, gas libraries, gas museums,
他就这么跑了 消失了 把我们晾在一边
He just ran off, disappeared, and left us hanging.
毒气图书馆
毒气博物馆 毒气舞厅
gas dance halls, and gas whore houses, etcetera.
我有一个助手 罗伯特·泰歇 一个年轻的美国人
I had an assistant, Robert Taicher, a young American man.
和毒气妓院等等
他说 你打算怎么办 我说 什么都没有 我要等
He said, "What are you going to do?" I said, "Nothing. I'm going to wait,
有人会给我30万美元 用报纸包起来
"and someone will bring me $300,000 wrapped up in a newspaper."
他说 你疯了 我说 是的 我是
He said, "You are crazy." And I said, "Yes, I am."
我坐在那里等着
I sat around waiting.
六个星期过去了 人们越来越绝望
Six weeks went by and people were getting desperate.
我说 我们等等吧 奇迹总会发生
I said, "Let's wait. Miracles happen."
泰彻失踪了
Taicher, who had disappeared -
我还以为他抛弃了我们 拿着个包裹回来了
I thought he had deserted us, came back with a parcel
用报纸包起来 里面有30万美元 然后给了我
wrapped in newspaper containing $300,000 and gave it to me.
他的父亲是美国最大的鞋类零售商之一
His father was one of the biggest footwear retailers in America.
他是个百万富翁 所以他拿走了30万美元
He was a millionaire. So he took $300,000
然后把它给了我电影就是这样结束的
and gave it to me. And that's how we finished the film.
我恨你 我恨你 我恨你
I hate you! I hate you...!
我的名字是艾克森
My name is Axon, my planet is Neptune.
我的星球是海王星
我是警察首长
I am the chief of police.
我很难找到这个男孩
I had trouble finding this boy.
我让我的同性恋助理帮我找个睾丸大的男孩
I asked my gay assistant to find me a boy with big testicles.
这是关于纳粹主义的我造了这个巨大的武器
This is about Nazism and I had this huge weapon built.
我想要一个纳粹仪式
I wanted a Nazi ceremony.
这个人在我们拍摄这一幕的时候服用了迷幻药
This man had taken LSD when we shot the scene.
在戏的结尾 我说停
At the end of the scene, I said, "Cut!"
他以为我的意思是切掉他的蛋蛋
He thought I meant, "Cut off his testicles!"
他差点就把他们切断了
He almost cut them off.
你看到 咔 哎哟
You see there... "Cut!" Ouch!
这是你一生中最美好的一天
This is the most beautiful day of your life.
那时这些发型并不流行
These hair styles weren't in vogue at that time.
出于你的自愿
Of your own free will you came to surrender part of your body to me.
你来把你身体的一部份交给我
它们是为电影而发明的 现在它们很常见
They were invented for the film. Nowadays they are very common.
你决定接受入会仪式
You decided to undergo the initiation
其他九百九十九个英雄们已经通过
that 999 other heroes have passed.
墨西哥的丑闻在我拍摄圣山的时候愈演愈烈
The scandal in Mexico grew as I shot The Holy Mountain.
你的牺牲完成了
Your sacrifice completes my sanctuary of one thousand testicles.
我被攻击了 两千人游行 把我和凶手曼森相提并论
I got attacked. 2,000 people marched equating me with Manson, the killer,
我的千睾圣殿
说他们想要我死 或者离开墨西哥
and saying they wanted me dead, or out of Mexico.
这是一个巨大的丑闻和真正的斗争拍摄
It was a great scandal and a real struggle to shoot.
教会指责我做黑人弥撒
The Church accused me of performing black masses.
这是圣书
This is the holy book. Learn to believe in me.
埃切维里亚 国防部长 威胁要杀了我
Echeverria, the minister of defense, threatened to kill me.
学习相信我
我带着所有的录像逃到纽约是因为他们来我家了
I fled to New York with all the footage because they came to my house.
有一个准军事组织叫鹰
There was a paramilitary group called "The Hawks".
他们打扮成平民 开始大喊
They were dressed as civilians and started shouting,
佐多罗夫斯基 我们要杀了你在午夜时分
"Jodorowsky, we are going to kill you," in the middle of the night.
我害怕他们会炸掉我的房子 而我的孩子们就在那里
I was afraid they would bomb my house, and my children were there.
我和家人聚在一起 搬到了纽约
I gathered my family together and moved to New York.
对我来说 这是最有趣的序列之一
For me, this is one of the most interesting sequences,
因为我在里面揭露了
because in it I reveal
特效的技巧
the artifice of special effects.
在屠杀学生中 你可以看到特效是如何制作出来的
In the slaughter of the students, you see how the special effects are made.
我把它公开地展示出来 但场面也一样戏剧化
I show it openly, but the scenes are just as dramatic.
烟雾穿过小巷 这是自然的 不是电子化的
Smoke moves through an alley. It was natural, it wasn't done electronically.
这是一个神圣的奇迹
It's a divine miracle.
艾克森是真理 力量和光芒
Axon is the truth and the power and the light...
这个人是建筑师
This man is an architect.
我的名字是鲁特
My name is Lut, my planet is Pluto.
我的星球是冥王星
我的事业是建筑
My business is architecture.
我认为当代社会最大的邪恶之一就是建筑
I think one of the greatest evils of contemporary society is architecture,
因为它是几何的 线性的
because of its geometric, linear forms.
例如 现在我们正在一个立方体里交谈
For instance, right now we are talking inside a cube.
但是大脑不是立体的或几何的 它有一个有机的形式
But the brain is not cubic or geometric, it has an organic form.
Where is he?
家和我们的精神 我们的机体
Homes do not match our spirit, our organism,
He's there, he's there!
No, no he's not!
这引发了一系列的心理疾病
and this provokes a series of psychological diseases.
He's up there. There he is! He's up there!
Go get him! Come on, let's go get him!
这是关于恋童癖 虐待儿童
This is about pedophilia, child abuse.
Where is he?
那时 没有人谈论这个问题
Back then, nobody spoke about this issue.
很明显他是个虐待儿童的人
Obviously he's a child abuser.
There he is!
所有的孩子都打扮成老鼠米妮
All the children are dressed up as Minnie Mouse.
这是典型的现代建筑
This is modern architecture with its typical buildings.
当我们建造这个多重家庭组合时
When we built this multi-family complex, we made a big mistake -
我们犯了大错
我们亏了钱
这里的每个人都是残废
Everybody here is crippled.
we lost money.
我们给他们小花园和窗户
We gave them small gardens and windows,
公寓楼 这是个悲剧
Blocks of flats... It's tragic.
我们安装了水 照明和加热系统
we installed water, lighting, and heating systems.
这是错误的观念
This was a wrong concept.
这是多户住宅的快照
It's a snapshot of multi-family units.
一个男人不需要家
A man doesn't need a home, all he needs is a shelter.
他需要的只是一个庇护所
如果我们可以卖给他庇护所
If we can sell him on the idea of a shelter, we can make millions.
我们就可以赚很多钱
高迪是唯一一个让我感动得流泪的建筑师
Gaudí is the only architect who has ever moved me to tears.
高迪用于即兴创作 当他建造的时候
Gaudí used to improvise. When he was building,
如果他发现了他喜欢的石头或雕塑
if he found a stone or a sculpture that he liked,
他将把它纳入他的计划
he would incorporate it into his project.
他是第一个打破盘子和制作马赛克的人
He was the first one to break dishes and make mosaics.
工人来到这里只是睡觉
A worker will come here only to sleep, he won't need electricity or water.
我认为他是最伟大的天才之一
I consider him one of the greatest geniuses.
他不需要电或水
他不需要做饭
我对高迪 达芬奇和谷克多有很深的敬佩
I have a deep admiration for Gaudí, Leonardo Da Vinci and Cocteau.
He won't have to cook, we'll condition him to eat at the factory.
我们会在工厂里提供他吃的
这些是整个建筑的公共厕所卡车
他们是通用的 他们不只练习一种艺术形式
They are versatile. They don't practice just one form of art.
These are communal latrine trucks for the entire building.
他们的作品中包含了各种形式的艺术
They include all forms of art in their work.
这是墨西哥最著名的异装癖者
This was the most famous transvestite in Mexico.
他的名字叫沙里玛 就像法国香水
His name was Shalimar, like the French perfume.
古斯塔沃·阿拉特里斯特曾制作过布尼乌尔的一些电影
Gustavo Alatriste, who had produced some of Buñuel's films,
购买圣山
bought The Holy Mountain.
由于担心墨西哥的丑闻 他决定不按原计划播出
Afraid of the scandal in Mexico, he decided not to screen it as it was.
他拥有一个实验性的连锁影院
He owned an experimental cinema chain.
他为他的影院剪辑了这部电影 剪掉了40分钟
He had the film edited for his theaters and cut out 40 minutes.
如今墨西哥终于派出这部电影来代表墨西哥电影
Nowadays Mexico sends out this film to represent Mexican cinema, finally.
我决定用英文拍摄圣山
I decided to film The Holy Mountain in English
因为艾伦·克莱因给了我这么做的钱
because Allen Klein gave me the money to do it.
他是美国人 而我想用英语拍这部电影
He was American and I wanted to shoot the film in English
这样他就可以在美国展示 把钱拿回来
so that he could show it in the States and get his money back.
做个自由的男人 没有家庭
没有房子 自由的城市
这里我展示的是我们如何生活在棺材里 这在后来的日本确实发生过
Here I show how we'll be living in coffins, which actually happened in Japan later.
在日本 他们有你不能躺下的酒店
In Japan they have hotels where you can't lie down.
我拍这张照片的时候他们还不存在
They didn't exist when I shot this.
我有个预感 我们会住在棺材里
I had a premonition that we'd live in coffins.
我想巧妙地展示不同部分之间的过渡
I wanted to show subtly the transition between the different parts,
不要表现得太明显
without being too obvious about it.
天空把它们连在一起
The sky links them all together.
我们在街上拍摄直升机的镜头并没有征得允许
We didn't ask for permission to shoot this helicopter scene from the street.
我们就这么做了 然后逃跑了
We just did it and ran away.
我们请了一个演员穿上警察制服去阻止交通
We got an actor to wear a police uniform and to stop the traffic.
我们拍完镜头就跑了
We shot the scene and ran off.
这九个字的介绍到此结束
The introduction of the nine characters ends here.
现在冒险开始了
Now the adventure begins.
你们有权力和钱
You have power and money, but you are mortal.
但你们是凡人
你们知道自己不能逃避死亡
You know you cannot escape death.
但却可以获得不朽
But immortality can be obtained.
在那些古老的传统中 他们都提到过圣山
In old traditions they speak of holy mountains.
所有这些山都存在
All of these mountains do exist.
印度的须弥山
The Meru mountain of India.
在远东和 中欧
In the Far East and in... Central Europe...
道士们的昆仑山
Mount Kunlun of the Taoists.
喜玛拉雅的喀喇昆仑山
The Karakoram of the Himalaya.
山 就像炼金术士一样 是一个很常见的象征
the mountain, just like the alchemist, is a very common symbol.
哲学家的山
The mountain of the philosophers.
蔷薇十字会的山
The Rosicrucian mountain.
圣十字若望的犹太神秘山
The Cabalistic mountain of San Juan De La Cruz.
佛教徒常到这座山上打坐
The Buddhists go to the mountain to meditate.
还有许多其他的圣山
There are many other holy mountains.
传说总是相同的
The legend is always the same.
这是天地合一的地方
It's where Heaven and Earth come together.
山顶上住着九个长生不老的人
Nine Immortal men live on top of the mountain.
从最高的山峰
From the highest peak they direct our world.
他们引导着我们的世界
他们拥有征服死亡的秘密
They hold the secret to the conquest of death.
他们超过四万岁
They are more than 40,000 years old.
但是他们曾经像我们一样
But they were once like ourselves.
有一个关于这些长生不老的人的炼金术传说
There is an alchemical legend about these immortal men,
如果其他人能够征服死亡
If others have succeeded in conquering death,
生活在地球上的一群人 大约有3万年的历史
a group of men who live on Earth and are about 30,000 years old.
我们为什么一定要接受它呢
why must we accept it?
我知道那些人住在哪里
I know where the Immortals live and how to obtain their secret.
和怎么获得他们的秘密
他们被称为赫利奥波利斯骑士
They're called the Knights of Heliopolis.
这是一个炼金术的传说
It's an alchemical legend.
在这个古老的蔷薇十字会手稿里
In this ancient Rosicrucian manuscript,
这是玫瑰十字架
Here is the rose cross.
我发现到九个长生不老的人
这是九型人格周围的智者
And here are the wise men around the enneagram.
I found an etching of the Nine Immortals and the place where they live.
以及他们住的地方的版画
莲花岛的圣山
The holy mountain of Lotus Island.
有些人联合起来袭击银行
Some men join forces to assault banks and steal money, pieces of paper.
为了偷钱 一些纸罢了
我们应该联合我们的力量袭击圣山
We must unite our forces to assault the holy mountain,
抢夺智者们长生不老的秘密
and rob its wise men of their secret of immortality.
从弗洛伊德开始 人们就说儿子从父亲那里偷火
Ever since Freud, it has been said that the son steals fire from his father.
但是为了征服他们的智慧
But to conquer the wisdom of the Immortals,
我们也要变成智者
we too must become wise men.
知识必须被窃取 没人给你
Knowledge has to be stolen. Nobody gives it to you.
化学元素有很多 但是很有限
The elements of chemistry are many, but finite.
诸神需要你做出努力
The gods need you to make an effort.
启蒙的技术也一样
So are the techniques of enlightenment.
没有什么是免费的 你得努力一下
Nothing is free. You have to make an effort.
为了更快地达到它
To reach it more quickly we will combine the techniques.
我们要融汇技巧
与正确的公式
With the correct formula, any human being can become enlightened.
任何人类都能变得开明
长生不老的人是一个集体
The Immortals are a group.
如果我们要成功
If we are to succeed, we must cease to be individuals,
我们一定要停止单独行动
同样变成一个集体
and become a collective being.
我喜欢这款眼形眼镜
I love this eye-shaped set.
烧了你们的钱
Burn your money!
我没告诉他们该怎么做 他们把钱扔进火里
I didn't tell them what to do. When they threw the money into the fire,
每个角色都以不同的方式投掷
each character tossed it in a different way.
艾拉把它们一个一个地扔出去
Isla tosses them one by one.
这家伙就像玩牌的人一样把他们甩了
This one tosses them like a card player.
百万富翁把它数了数再扔
The millionaire counts it before tossing it.
小偷拿着它
The thief keeps it.
这个女人母猪
This woman sows.
纳粹想了想 然后残忍地把它扔了
The Nazi thinks it over and then brutally tosses it.
这个人很贪婪 做事很费时
This man is greedy and takes his time before doing it.
富人是花费时间最长的人
The rich man is the one who takes the longest.
小偷 如果你不想死 烧了你的钱
Thief! If you don't want to die, kill your money.
一张钞票从天上掉下来 真是个奇迹
A banknote fell from the sky, that was a miracle.
我们将毁灭自我形象
We shall destroy the self-image,
不稳定 摇摆
unsteady, wavering, bewildered,
迷惑 充满渴望
full of desire, distracted, confused.
心烦意乱 困惑
当自我观念认为
When the self-concept thinks, this is I and that is mine,
这是我和那是我的
他就束缚了自己
he binds himself and he forgets the great self.
忘却了那伟大的自我
焚毁雕塑是我优雅生涯的结束
The burning of the sculptures was the end of my elegant phase,
我的艺术电影摄影
my art-film photography.
一旦这些尸体被烧毁
Once these bodies were burnt,
我意识到是时候回到现实了
I realized it was time to go back to reality.
我简化了射击方式
I simplified the shooting style,
把它变成了真人电影
and made it more like cinéma vérite.
这是最后的美学场景
This is the last aesthetic scene.
从这里开始 风格改变了
From here on, the style changes.
我不仅烧了这些雕像 也烧了我的风格
Not only do I burn the statues, but I burn my style as well.
我烧掉了我对电影的幻想 我不想再要了
I burn my vision of cinema. I don't want it anymore.
它太漂亮
It's too beautiful.
这是经过深思熟虑和审美的
It's too thought-out and aesthetic.
我们会转向更真实的东西
We move on to something more real.
当我们开始拍摄时 国防部长考基迪很高兴
When we started shooting, Corkidi, the DP, was delighted,
但后来他成了我的敌人因为他什么都不懂
but then he became my enemy because he didn't understand anything.
他没听懂 他喜欢开头是因为它的美学品质
He didn't get it. He liked the beginning because of the aesthetical qualities,
但是当我进入现实 在蒙特拍摄一个场景Albán
but when I went into reality and filmed a scene in Monte Albán
给所有的演员都注射了迷幻蘑菇
and gave hallucinogenic mushrooms to all the actors,
他拍错了 我不能用那段录像 因为他不懂
he shot it all wrong. I couldn't use the footage because he didn't get it.
这是墨西哥巫医 按摩师
This is a Mexican witch doctor, a masseur.
他是个真正的巫医 不是演员
He is an authentic witch doctor, not an actor.
在他的真实环境中 他是一个真正的萨满
He is a real shaman in his real environment.
你看他的手就知道了
You can tell by looking at his hands.
现在这部电影正在寻找真相 但不是在童话里
Now the movie is seeking the truth, but not in a fairytale,
在现实生活中
in real life.
他的脚就像腐烂的狗一样臭
- His feet stink like a rotten dog. - He has beautiful teeth.
他的牙齿很漂亮
我忍受不了那个气味
I can't stand the smell.
等他把你所有的骨头重新拼回去
When he puts all your bones back together, you will like his smell.
你就会喜欢他的气味了
这是在泰波兹兰地区 据说这里曾经是墨西哥的伊甸园
This is in the Tepoztlan area, which is said to have been the Mexican Eden,
诸神居住的地方 这是一块神圣的土地
where the gods lived. It was a sacred land.
人类学会了削减植被以耕作土地
Man learned to cultivate the earth by weakening the plants,
我说 让我们在山顶拍摄吧 我们会找到一位大师的
I said, "Let's film at the top of that mountain and we'll find a master."
野生植物自从被创造之初
wild plants remained as they were at the moment of creation.
就一直保持不变
这个女人在等着
And this woman was waiting.
它们是谦卑的守护者 保护着秘密
They are the humble guardians of the secret.
没有人告诉她 她说 我是来帮助你的
No one had told her anything, and she said, "I've come to help you."
她是另一个住在山里的萨满
She is another shaman who lives in the mountains.
看她把汤端得多准
Look at how precisely she dishes out the soup.
这个过程是完美无瑕的
The process is flawless, perfect,
就像主人一样
just like the master herself.
我没有给萨满下达指令
I didn't give directions to the shamans.
他们做他们喜欢的 我使用的材料
They did as they pleased and I used that material.
当我们到达蒙特Albán时 另一个萨满正在等我们
When we got to Monte Albán, another shaman was waiting for us.
我知道我总能在这些地方找到一位师父 他会教给我们一些东西
I knew I'd always find a master in these places who would teach us something,
他就在那里
and there he was.
他们不是演员 他们住在那里
They are not actors, they live there.
花儿知道
The flower knows... you don't need to ask it.
你不需要问
它们在植物间游荡 用身体收集花粉
They are wandering among plants, gathering pollen with their bodies.
他们与大自然接触
They're in contact with nature.
这是神圣植物的世界 它们能产生幻觉
This is the world of the sacred plants, which produce hallucinations.
刀伤看起来很假
The knife cut looks fake,
但我是故意这么做的
but it's something that I did on purpose.
演员们被锁在一所房子里两个月
The actors spent two months locked in a house,
每天只睡四个小时 做各种各样的运动
sleeping only four hours a day and doing all kinds of exercises.
我给他们吃了迷幻蘑菇
I gave them hallucinogenic mushrooms.
他们完全融入其中
They completely tuned into it.
卡斯塔内达已经解决了人类对动物的迁移问题
Castañeda had tackled the issue of human transference to animals,
这是一种神奇的实践
which is a magical practice.
我在墨西哥一家叫阿根廷角的阿根廷餐厅
I was in an Argentinean restaurant in Mexico called El Rincón Argentino,
在那里你只能吃到大牛排和红酒
where the only thing you can get is huge steaks and wine.
我坐在那里 卡斯塔内达出现了
I was sitting there and Castañeda showed up.
狗会把你的感官带走
我说我们能谈谈吗他说他已经看过大地两次了
I said, "Can we have a chat?" He said he had seen El Topo twice
The dog will take your senses away with him.
它能替你看
He can see for you.
很有兴趣和我聊天 我说 我们在哪儿见面
and was interested in talking to me. I said, "Where should we meet?
我应该去你的旅馆吗 他说 不 我要去你家 和他做
"Should I go to your hotel?" He said, "No, I'll come to yours." And he did.
那是卡米诺皇家酒店 我们聊了聊
It was the Camino Real Hotel. We had a chat.
花儿的纤细气味是宇宙的芳香
The delicate scent of flowers is the fragrance of the universe.
我吃花儿
I eat the flower, and its perfume is my blood.
我告诉他 我不确定你是天才 江湖骗子还是疯子
I told him, "I'm not sure whether you're a genius, a charlatan, or a madman.
它的芳香就是我的血液
Together we form a dog, in search of the sacred flower.
我们一起组成一只狗
我们能一起做些什么 我们为什么在一起
"What can we do together? Why are we together?"
来寻找神圣的花儿
他说 我接到一个邀请 要把唐璜的教诲拍成电影
He said, "I've got an offer to make The Teachings of Don Juan into a film,
Together we form a flower, in search of the sacred water.
我们一起组成一朵花
来寻找神圣的水
但我不想和好莱坞明星一起演
"but I don't want to do it with some Hollywood star."
这是语言被赋予血肉的瞬间
This is the moment when the word is made flesh.
我说 小心点 他们不会拍动作片和特效大片
I said, "Be careful they don't do a big action, special effects movie.
应该去真正的拍摄地 和真正的唐璜一起拍摄
"One should go to the real location and shoot it with the real Don Juan."
嗯 他说 但他坚持不下去了
"Well..." he said, but he couldn't carry on,
因为他的胃痛很厉害 还开始拉肚子
because his got a terrible stomach pain and his diarrhea started.
他说 我在山里喝水 从来没有生病
He said, "I drank water in the mountains and never got sick,
现在我在墨西哥喝水 还拉屎
"and now I drink water here in Mexico and I'm shitting myself."
我说我带你去旅馆他说 好的 谢谢
I said, "I'll take you to your hotel." He said, "Yes, please."
我用出租车把他送到旅馆 那是我最后一次见到他
I took him to his hotel in a taxi and that was the last time I saw him.
How many people are you?
你们有多少人
One, two, three, four, five...
一 二 三 四 五
We are nine.
我们九个人
一 二 三 四 五
One, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine...
六 七 八 九
- One is missing. - Yes.
一个失踪了
是的
寻人启事是一个经典的中国故事
This legend of The Missing Person is a classic Chinese story.
Here is the missing one. He drowned.
那个失踪的在这 他淹死了
他们进化了 忘记了自己
They have evolved and forgotten about themselves
以至于他们不再认识自己的形象
to the point that they no longer recognize their own image.
他们以为自己在和别人约会 他们忘记了自己
They think they're seeing someone else. They've forgotten about themselves.
他们认为有人淹死了 这是一个中国故事
They think somebody has drowned. It's a Chinese story.
He drowned.
他淹死了
我教这只猴子做一种禅坐姿势
I taught the monkey to do a mudra, a Zen position.
我花了好几个小时才让这只猴子像禅僧一样把手放好
It took me hours to get the monkey to place its hands like a Zen monk.
这是死亡的仪式
This is the ceremony of death.
坟墓用爱接受你
The grave receives you with love.
这里离之前的地方很远 这是玛雅金字塔
This is miles away from the previous place. It's a Mayan pyramid.
让你自己顺从死亡
Surrender yourselves to death.
还了借给你的所有
Return what was loaned to you.
我参观了墨西哥金字塔
I visited the Mexican pyramids.
放弃你的快乐 你的痛苦
Give up your pleasure, your pains.
放弃你的朋友 你的爱人
Give up your friends, your lovers.
演员们沉浸在这段经历中
The actors were so engrossed in the experience,
放弃你的家人 你的过去
Give up your family, your past.
他们真的在为自己的死亡而哭泣
that they were actually crying over their own death.
放弃你所恨的 你所渴望的
Surrender what you hate, what you desire.
他们不是在演戏 他们是真实的人在哭泣
They are not acting, they are real people crying.
你会知道虚无
You will know nothingness -
这就是唯一的真实
it is the only reality.
我希望最后的部分是一部纪录片
I wanted the last part to be a documentary.
不要害怕
Don't be afraid. It's so easy to give.
我想从一部虚构的电影变成一部纪录片
I wanted to go from a fictional film to a documentary.
很容易给予
你不是孤独的
You are not alone. You have a grave.
你有个坟墓
我按时间顺序拍摄 这样演员就能感受到变化
I filmed it chronologically, so that the actors could feel the change.
它是你第一个母亲
It is your first mother.
坟墓是你重生之门
The grave is the door to your rebirth.
现在你将交出你曾经称为
Now you will surrender the faithful animal you once called your body.
身体的虔诚动物
不要设法保有它
Don't try to keep it.
记着 那是借出的东西
Remember, it was a loan.
交出你的腿 你的生殖器
Surrender your legs, surrender your sex,
你的头 你的血液
your hair, your blood, your organs, your bones.
你的器官 你的骨头
你不再想要占有
You no longer want to possess.
占有是最终的痛苦
Possession is the ultimate pain.
泥土掩盖了你的尸体
The earth falls over your corpse.
她用爱来遮盖你
在两个月的拍摄期间
During the two months of shooting,
She comes to cover you with love,
每次我们开始拍摄 雨就停了
every time we started filming, it stopped raining.
因为她是你真正的血肉
because she is your true flesh.
拍摄结束后 天又开始下雨
We finished shooting, and it started raining again.
现在你是一颗空无的心
Now you are an empty heart,
张开去接受你最真实的本体
open to receive your truest selves.
每一天都是奇迹 你可以看到天空多云
Each day was a miracle. You can see the sky is cloudy.
你自己的完美
Your own perfection, your new body,
你新的身体 那是宇宙
which is the universe, the work of God.
神的杰作
你会获得重生 你会成为真实
You will be born again, you will be real,
你会成为你自己的父亲
you will be your own father, your own mother,
你自己的母亲 你自己的孩子
your own child, your own perfection.
你自己的完美
睁开你的眼睛
Open your eyes. You are the earth, you are the green,
你是泥土 你是植物
你是蓝天 你是首位
you are the blue, you are the Aleph, you are the essence.
你是本初之源
看那花儿
Look at the flower. Look at the flower.
第一次看那花儿
看那花儿
For the first time, look at the flowers.
现在你们是一个集体
Now, you are a group.
我们得付钱给保安 这样他才允许我们上去
We had to pay the guard so that he allowed us to get up there.
我拍摄了35个小时的素材
I filmed 35 hours' worth of material,
但大部分都损坏了 所以我不能用
but much of it got damaged, so I couldn't use it.
我只能凑合着用这个 剩下的就只有这个了
I had to make do with this, which is all that was left.
枪击持续了六个月因为他们阻止了我们六个星期
The shooting lasted six months because they stopped us for six weeks.
我们游遍了墨西哥
We traveled all over Mexico.
在后期制作期间 艾伦·克莱因在纽约租了一间公寓
During post-production, Allen Klein rented out an apartment in New York
你想要像基督一样施展奇迹吗
Do you want to perform miracles like Christ?
为了我 也为了编辑 一个曾经编辑过鼹鼠的老人
for me and for the editor, an old man who had edited El Topo.
看看如果你做了会发生什么事情
See what would happen if you did.
他叫费德里科·兰德罗斯 他参与了大约2000部墨西哥电影的制作
His name was Federico Landeros. He'd worked on about 2,000 Mexican films.
他花了三个月的时间在纽约拍摄这部电影
He spent about three months in New York working on this film.
我们还在纽约的录音室录制了声音
We also recorded the sound in a New York studio
我还请来了一位墨西哥音效专家 加维拉
and I brought in a Mexican sound effects specialist, Gavira.
他会用拳头捶肚子 玩小玩意来制造噪音
He'd make noises by punching his stomach, playing with little gadgets...
一切都是临时的 它是奇妙的
Everything was improvised. It was fantastic.
弗里德金看到了他 就问 请把他给我吧
Friedkin saw him and asked, "Please, give him to me."
所以我的加维拉为 驱魔人做了音效 并赢得了奥斯卡奖
So my Gavira made the sound effects for The Exorcist and won an Oscar.
这是一艘捕虾船在
This was a shrimp boat in the middle of...
它的名字是什么
What's its name?
加勒比海
The Caribbean Sea.
有一场戏我拍不下来 我想让大家都跳进海里
There was a scene I couldn't shoot. I wanted us all to jump into the sea,
进入无尽的水域
to get in the infinite waters.
我们跳进海里 开始被淹死
We jumped into the sea and started to drown.
船员们忙着扔绳子之类的东西来救我们
The crew was so busy throwing ropes and so on to save us,
全神贯注在这个海星上
Concentrate on this starfish.
当它在你眼里你有了大象的大小
When you see the size of an elephant, you will never miss the target.
他们没有向我们开枪
that they didn't shoot us.
在水中的那一幕消失了
That scene in the water got lost.
你就永远不会错过目标
我们都跳了进去 没有想到这是开放水域 还有鲨鱼
We all jumped in without thinking that this was open water and there were sharks.
我们的思想有着它的形式
Our thoughts have forms.
我们正在经历一场神秘的冒险
We were living out a mystical adventure.
你的头脑里有一个怪物
You have a monster in your mind.
我们会帮助你
We will help you.
当我拍圣山的时候 我想打破电影制作的规则
When I made The Holy Mountain, I wanted to break the rules of film-making.
首先 我打破了故事规则
First of all, I broke the "story" rule.
我们所知道的电影主要来自美国 它是由第一幕
Cinema as we know it, which comes mainly from America, consists of a first act,
英雄不愿意参与他所面对的行动
where the hero is reluctant to be part of some action he is confronted with.
然后发生了一些事 英雄也参与其中
Then something happens and the hero gets involved.
在第二幕 他有敌人也有盟友
There's a second act, where he's got enemies and allies,
第三幕 一切都得到解决
and a third act, where everything gets solved.
在圣山我打破了那种结构 我不想讲故事
In The Holy Mountain I broke that structure. I didn't want to tell a story.
我想用不同的方式来表现角色和表达自己
I wanted to present characters and express myself differently.
把怪物丢进水里
Throw the monster into the water.
自我遭受偏差
The ego suffers deviations.
我们有偏执狂偏差 精神分裂症偏差
We have paranoid deviations, schizophrenic deviations,
他不会游泳 他会淹死的
He can't swim, he will drown.
自我表现欲和自恋
exhibitionism and narcissism.
傻瓜 毁灭你的幻觉
Fool, destroy your illusions.
自我承受着各种各样的偏差
The ego suffers all kinds of deviations.
把你从过去解放出来
Free yourself from the past.
小偷把另一只扔进了海里 从而摆脱了自己的烦恼
The thief gets rid of his deviations when he throws the other one into the sea.
他摆脱了他的怪物
He gets rid of his monstrosity.
偏离自我是根据一个人拥有什么来定义的
A deviated ego is defined in terms of what one has.
我是我所拥有的一切
"I am what I have got."
当你的自我是你想要的 而不是别人想要的
When your ego is what you want it to be, and not what others want it to be,
你们已经成功地塑造了它 现在它为你们的本质服务
you have succeeded in molding it and now it is at the service of your essence.
我们穿过了伟大的水
We have crossed the great waters.
他们在陆地上 现在电影的另一部分开始了
They are on dry land and now another part of the film begins.
每个人都真的剪了头发
Everybody cut their hair for real.
好极了 好极了
恭喜 你们到达了我们的海岸
Congratulations, you made it to our shores! This deserves a toast!
这值得干杯
你们不是第一批来到莲花岛
You're not the first to come to Lotus Island in search of the holy mountain.
寻找圣山的人
这是伊扎塔克·华特尔 墨西哥城附近的一座著名的山
This is Iztaccíhuatl, a famous mountain near Mexico City.
I drink alone because newcomers are always abstainers.
我一个人喝酒
因为新来的人总是滴酒不沾
不过迟早他们都会意识到
In time they realize that the best liquor in the world
世界上最好的酒就在万神殿酒吧
这是罗丹的雕像 思想者 象征着知性主义的缺陷
This is the Rodan statue, "The Thinker", symbolizing the flaws of intellectualism.
is at the Pantheon Bar.
快来 快来 来 我拥有一切
Come. Come. Come. I have everything -
吃的 喝的 睡的 洗澡的
food, drinks, beds, baths, men, women.
男人 女人
这里是那些几乎完全开悟的人
Here are those who almost achieved complete enlightenment,
但他们在社会层面 名声和成功上止步不前
but they stopped short at the social level, at fame, at success.
这是一个以成功为导向的世界 似乎成功是唯一的目标
It's a success-oriented world, as if success were the only goal.
我读了一本给我留下深刻印象的书叫做博伽梵歌
I read a book that marked me profoundly called the Bhagavad-Gita.
这是一本印度教的圣书 它的第一条戒律是
It is a Hindu sacred book whose first precept is,
考虑工作 而不是结果
"Think of the work, not about the result."
第二 让你的工作表达你内心的上帝
Second, "Let your work express your inner god."
这些杰出的旅行者来到这里
第三 把你的工作当作神圣的祭品来对待
And third, "Approach your work as you would a sacred sacrifice."
These illustrious travelers came here to find the holy mountain,
想要寻找圣山
不过他们却比较喜欢万神殿酒吧
but they preferred The Pantheon Bar!
我的艺术抱负在增长 我想制作 沙丘
My artistic ambition grew - I wanted to make Dune,
我参与了一个大到无法实施的项目
and I got involved in a project so big that it was not feasible.
The real holy mountain is here -
真正的圣山在这里
我想 没关系 这部电影不是我拍的 但失败不代表什么
I thought, "It's OK." I didn't make the film, but failure doesn't mean anything,
在我的言语中 在我的诗句中
in my words, in my poems.
如果我写玫瑰
它只是意味着改变道路
it just means changing paths.
If I write rose, it blooms in my hand,
它就会在我手中盛开
这个角色的灵感来自于诗人艾伦·金斯伯格
This character is inspired by the poet Allen Ginsberg.
蜜蜂会过来舔食我的诗句
And the bees come to feed on my poetry.
我想说的是你不能用这种诗歌来达到启蒙
I was trying to say you couldn't reach enlightenment with this kind of poetry.
我们的蜜蜂会制造蜂蜜
Our bees make honey, but your flies make shit.
你的苍蝇只会制造屎
这仅仅是迈向成功的第一步
It is merely a step on the road to it.
The cross was a mushroom.
十字架是蘑菇
蘑菇也是善良与邪恶的大树
And the mushroom was also the tree of good and evil.
这是针对蒂莫西·利里和他的毒品的袭击
This is an attack on Timothy Leary and his drugs.
炼金术士的点金石
The philosophical stone of the alchemists...
是
...was LSD.
我取笑他
I poke fun at him.
LSD
我的观点是 你也不会通过LSD来实现开悟
My point is that you will not achieve enlightenment through LSD either.
重要的是要知道 如果你喝酒
It is important to know that if you drink,
死者之书是一段旅行
The book of the dead is a trip,
吸毒 抽烟
have drugs and smoke,
启示录描写的是一次致幻剂体验
and the Apocalypse describes a mescaline experience.
你的生活更紧张 但也更短暂
your life is more intense, but it is also shorter.
艺术家的奋斗是漫长的
An artist's struggle isf very long.
你必须非常有耐心和毅力 你不能放弃
You must be very patient and persevering. You can't give up.
这些小瓶子里面
In these flasks...
你要花很多年才能得到你想要的 所以你需要活得很长
It takes years to get what you want, so you need to live a very long life.
都是圣山
...are all the holy mountains.
在我75岁的时候 我只是一个初学者
At my 75 years of age, I am just a beginner.
在这个美丽的年轻人里面
And in this beautiful young man...
有着永恒
...is eternity.
征服一座山易如反掌
这个人代表了那些通过努力寻求满足的人
This man represents those who seek fulfillment by making great efforts.
To conquer a mountain is easy.
I can go through solid matter.
就我而言 就像如履平地
没有任何东西可以阻止我
Nothing stops me!
我可以在一分钟之内穿越圣山
In a minute I will cross the holy mountain. Wait for me here!
在这里等我
不用一分钟
I got to the other side of the mountain in less than a minute.
我就能到达山的另一边
你抵达峰顶需要多久
- How long until you reach the summit? - No, I can only advance horizontally.
我不知道 我只能走水平线
那样足够了
That's enough.
从底部到顶部 我做不到
From bottom to top, I can't do.
但无论如何 我是冠军
But anyway, I am a champion!
我水平地征服圣山
I have conquered the holy mountain horizontally!
Horizontally! I am a champion! I am a champion!
我是冠军
是我创建的学院 是我颁发的奖项
I founded the academy. I give the awards!
你们可以每年拿一次奖杯
Here you can win a trophy every year.
白痴 你们不知道自己失去了什么
Idiots! You don't know what you are losing!
你们本来可以创造历史
You could have made history and we are already forgetting you!
他们离开了世俗 他们离开了历史
They have left the mundane behind, they leave history,
我们会忘记你们
为了寻求匿名的开悟
in order to seek anonymous enlightenment.
这是我们真正开始攀登这座山的时候
And this is when we actually started climbing up this mountain.
两个月前 这里有17人死于一场风暴
Two months earlier, seventeen people had died here in a storm.
在登山场景中 电影制作人往往会使用一些技巧
For a mountain-climbing scene, film-makers tend to use tricks.
我决定我们得爬上去
I decided we had to climb it.
但由于海拔太高 我们每走一步都筋疲力尽
But we got exhausted with every step because of the altitude.
我们不能长时间拍摄 因为我们累了
We couldn't film for long because we got tired.
救我 我攀不上去了
Help me! I can't go one step farther!
那是因为你害怕摔下去
You're not afraid of falling. What frightens you is climbing.
恐惧让你难以攀登
用你的阴蒂摩擦山脉
- Rub your clitoris against the mountain. - You're terrified of success.
你害怕成功
把你自己交给世界
Give yourself to the world!
弟子们正在与自然接触 从外在到内在
The disciples are getting in touch with nature, externally and internally.
当他们爬上高山 他们面对大地力量
When they climb up the mountain, they confront the telluric forces,
他们内心的力量 内心的恶魔
and their internal forces, their inner demons,
他们克服了这些困难
and they get over them.
就像他们能克服寒冷一样 他们能克服内心的恶魔
Just like they get over the cold, they get over their inner demons.
一座山 一座山 一座山
Another mountain, and another one, and another one...
你永远不能停止 因为世界是永恒的无常
You must never stop, because the world is a permanent impermanence.
你必须以恒心走向无常
You must go toward the impermanence with perseverance,
用奉献和信念
with dedication and faith.
我不能再瞒下去了
I can't lie anymore.
我的手冻住了
My hand is frozen.
你从来不能忘记自己的肉身
You were never able to forget your body,
从来不能抛开自己的喜好
never able to pry yourself from that love.
Now the thing you love most is stopping you from reaching the top.
现在你喜好的东西阻止你攀登高峰
You must sacrifice part of your body.
你一定要牺牲你身体的部份
割断手指或者回去
Cut off your fingers, or go back!
我们花了一 二 三 花了四天时间爬山
It took us one, two, three... four days to climb the mountain.
当我们到达山顶时 我们终于可以呼吸了 不再觉得累了
When we reached the top, we could finally breathe and no longer felt tired.
我不知道为什么 但疲惫消失了
I am not sure why, but the exhaustion disappeared.
我们已经克服了山脉最困难的部份
就像已经完成了
It's like a finished effort.
We have mastered the difficult part of the mountain.
现在这条路对我们就像一座花园
Now the way will be like a garden.
然而在这样的高度 我们的心灵将会解体
Nevertheless, at this height our minds will decompose.
我们会经历死亡的幻觉
And we will suffer the vision of death.
撒谎
- Lies! - If you don't believe, wait for us here.
如果不相信 在这里等着
当我回来时 我会让你明白的
When I return, I will show you the difficult way.
我们有一只老虎和一只猴子 天气开始变冷了
We had a tiger and a monkey. It started getting cold.
暴风雨就要来了 但我还是继续拍摄
A storm was coming, but I kept filming.
我想把马埋得更深
I wanted the horses to be buried deeper in the ground,
但是土壤太硬了
but the soil was too hard.
在这个序列中 我解释了每个角色的梦
In this sequence, I interpret every character's dreams.
我问他们 你们最大的恐惧是什么
I asked them, "What is your greatest fear?"
他们告诉我他们的执念
And they told me about their obsessions.
这些是真正的格斗犬
These are real fighting dogs.
他们都要面对自己的地狱 不仅是故事的地狱 还有他们自己的地狱
They all confront their own hell. Not only the story's hell, but their own.
他们都疯了 因为他们看到了自己的地狱
They all went crazy in this sequence, because they saw their own hell.
这个人非常害怕被阉割
This man was very scared of castration.
他被他母亲阉割了 那棵树上满是去势的鸡
He's being castrated by his mother. The tree is covered in castrated chickens.
这个男人非常害怕蜘蛛 并不是因为他是同性恋
This man was very scared of spiders, and not because he was a homosexual.
蜘蛛是性的象征 这些都是狼蛛
Spiders are sexual symbols. These are tarantulas.
我害怕狼蛛
I am terrified of tarantulas.
但这是今天的最后一个镜头 所以我用手抓住了它们
But this was the last shot of the day, so I grabbed them with my hands.
这个人害怕雌雄同体 因为他扮演维纳斯
This one feared the androgynous, because he played Venus.
他是电影中那个自恋的人 害怕雌雄同体的人
He was the narcissistic one in the film and feared the androgynous.
这个人是半男半女 看看这张脸
This person is half man, half woman. Look at the face.
乳房变成了野生动物
The breasts become wild animals.
这很简单 却很超现实
It's very simple, but surreal.
我们快结束了 我们要摧毁最后的幻象
We're near the end. We're about to destroy the last illusion.
整部电影都在不断地破坏幻想 以达到现实
The whole film is a constant destruction of illusions, in order to get to reality.
永生者们在那
There are the Immortals!
在攻击他们之前必须冥想三个小时
Meditate here for three hours before you attack them.
你呢
And you?
你们现在不需要师父了
You don't need a master now.
你们自己就能获胜
You can win by yourself.
再见了
Goodbye.
圣山相关的鼹鼠
The Holy Mountain is related to El Topo.
它不是一个线性意义上的故事的延续
It isn't a continuation of the story in a linear sense,
这条路直达峰顶
This is the way we may reach that summit.
但它反映了我的进化过程
but it reflects my evolutionary process.
那时候我们会克服自己的身体
Then we will master our bodies.
鼹鼠是我灵魂的自画像
El Topo is a self-portrait of my soul.
现在你知道自己必须做什么了
You know now what you must do.
而在圣山中 你可以看到有一个更大的觉知
And in The Holy Mountain you can see that there is a greater awareness.
你不再需要任何人
You don't need anyone, you are a master.
自己就是大师了
砍下我的头
Cut off my head.
不可思议的事情发生了
Something incredible happened in this scene.
那个有点不知所措的演员真的给了我一拳
The actor, who had lost it a bit, gave me the blow for real,
我脖子上还有个伤疤 我可以给你看 他差点杀了我
and I still have a scar on my neck. I can show it to you. He nearly killed me.
幸运的是 这不是一把真剑
Luckily, it wasn't a real sword.
否则 我早就被斩首了
Otherwise... I'd have been decapitated.
这就像以撒的故事
This is like the story of Isaac,
亚伯拉罕将在上帝的要求下牺牲他的儿子
when Abraham is going to sacrifice his son at God's request
你的学习从现在开始
Now you can begin to learn.
上帝用羔羊取代了他的儿子
and God replaces his son with a lamb.
小偷不能跟着其他人 他被送回了现实世界
The thief can't follow the others. He is sent back to the real world.
与这个好女人结合
Unite yourself with this good woman,
她来到这里 只因为她爱你
who came here only because she loves you.
在现实世界里结婚生子 过得快乐
"Get married, have children, be happy in the real world.
不要寻找其他东西 平静地死去
"Don't look for other things. Die peacefully,"
忘掉峰顶
Forget the summits, reach eternity through love.
藉由爱达到不朽
因为我们有一部分永远无法到达圣山
because there is a part of us that will never reach the Holy Mountain.
回到你的国家去
Return to your country.
我们追求完美 但佛陀也有身体
We seek perfection, but even the Buddha has a body.
我把塔楼和的炼金工坊留给你
I leave you my tower and my alchemical rooms.
基督虽然是上帝 却有一个人的身体
And Christ, despite being God, has a human body.
This is your family and your people.
教导你的家庭和你的人们
人的身体是会死的
The human body is mortal.
Change the world.
改变世界
我们必须接受自己的这一部分 并将其释放到现实世界中
We must accept that part of ourselves and set it free in the real world.
这部分必须回到世界上
That part must go back to the world.
精神上的 开明的人 必须在这个世界上取得成功
The spiritual, enlightened being, must succeed in the world.
他不是一个受害者 必须学会在这个世界上取得成功
He is not a victim and must learn to succeed in the world.
主人对他们开了个玩笑 好让他们继续赶路
The master played a trick on them to keep them going.
这就像用胡萝卜来戏弄一头驴子 让它走路
It's like taunting a donkey with a carrot to make it walk.
他告诉他们 你们不会找到永生 但你们会找到现实
He tells them, "You will not find immortality, but you'll find reality."
坐下来
Sit down.
我许诺给你们那伟大的秘密
I promised you the great secret and I will not disappoint you.
我不会让你们失望
我本不想以这种方式结束这部电影
I didn't intend to end the film this way.
我最初的想法是让它们漂浮在空中 然后长生不老
My initial idea was that they would float in the air and become immortal.
但我在一场暴风雨中从山上摔了下来 以为我们要死了
But I fell down the mountain during a storm and thought we were going to die,
这是我们冒险的终结吗
Is this the end of our adventure?
于是我把斧子敲进石头里 说 我不能死 我必须把这部电影拍完
so I hammered my axe into a rock and said, "I can't die. I must finish this film."
Nothing has an end.
没有任何事物会终结
我们来寻找长生不老的秘密
We came in search of the secret of immortality.
我决定在现实世界结束这一切
And I decided to end it in the real world.
要像神一样
To be like gods.
我们是凡人 电影是幻觉
We're mortal and cinema is an illusion.
如今看看我们 还是凡人
And here we are...mortals.
甚至比以往更像凡人
More human than ever.
我不会给观众他们想要的
I am not giving the viewers what they are hoping for.
他们希望角色漂浮起来 创造奇迹
They expect the characters to levitate and perform a miracle.
如果我们没有获得长生不老
If we have not obtained immortality,
但至少我们获得了真实
at least we have obtained reality.
我不会那样做的
I'm not doing that,
我们起步于童话故事
We began in a fairytale and we came to life!
我不是在讲童话
I'm not telling fairytales.
最终回到了生活 不过
But is this life reality?
这个生活就是真正的现实吗
不
No.
It is a film.
这只是电影
摄影机往后拉
Zoom back camera.
这个结局引起了很大的争议 这激怒了很多人
This ending caused a great controversy. It enraged many people.
We are images, dreams, photographs.
我们是影像 梦 照片
有些人喜欢它 当然
Some people liked it. Of course!
我们不能留在这里
We must not stay here!
你期待他们永生 但突然间 你发现这只是一部电影
You expect them to become immortal, and, all of a sudden, you see it's just a film.
囚犯
Prisoners!
我们将打破幻觉
We shall break the illusion.
这是幻象
This is Maya.
九型人格是干什么用的 我把它扔了 够了
And what's the enneagram for? I throw it out. Enough of this!
足够的符号
Enough of symbols!
再见了圣山
Goodbye to the holy mountain.
Real life awaits us.
这对演员来说是一个惊喜
It was a surprise for the actors.
他们有很长一段时间拒绝和我说话 他们恨我
They refused to talk to me for a long time. They hated me.
现在它渐渐褪去 我们看到了电影的真正含义 一束纯净的光
Now it fades and we see what cinema really is: a pure light.
艾伦·克莱因对我的工作非常热心
Allen Klein was very enthusiastic about my work.
他给了我一百万美元让我做任何我想做的事
He gave me a million dollars to do whatever I wanted.
然后他把我带到美国 让我来做音乐
And then he brought me to America so I could work on the soundtrack,
因为我在墨西哥收到过死亡威胁
because I had received death threats in Mexico.
他想让我把O的故事做成
He wanted me to make The Story of O.
一部情色电影
It was an erotic film.
他很兴奋 因为
He was very excited because...
我们要取得巨大的商业成功
We were going to make a huge commercial success.
但我决定我不想拍色情电影
But I decided I didn't want to make an erotic film.
我记得我们在英国 艾伦·克莱因采访了一些制片人
I remember we were in England. Allen Klein talked to some producers
他给了我20万美元让我拍这部电影
and he had given me $200,000 to make the film.
我突然跑开了 我只是消失了
I suddenly ran off. I just vanished.
我把一切都交给了他们去拍沙丘
I left everything in their hands and went to make Dune.
他告诉我 你永远拍不出那部电影 这个项目太大了
He told me, "You'll never make that film. It's too big a project.
没有人会看你的电影 他非常生气
"And nobody will ever see your films." He was very angry.
从那一刻起 我的电影就不再放映了
From that moment on, my films were not shown.
他有充分的理由生气 我也有理由随心所欲
He had good reasons to be angry and I had my reasons to do as I pleased.
30年过去了
30 years went by