We're really pleased to have Dr Liz McKenzie, who's a faculty member here at
the University of Pennsylvania. To help us with some of our discussions
for week one. Now, you're going to learn a great deal
more about Dr McKenzie in week four, when she's back for a full interview.
But right now we want to ask Liz to join us to discuss two really critical
questions. So Liz, welcome to Old Globe.
Anne and I are really thrilled to have you.
>> Thank you, I'm happy to be here. >> Thanks.
and we wanted to get your perspective, based on both your science and your
extensive educational background on two questions.
And those questions are, when we use the phrase, Psychological aging, and when we
use the phrase, social aging. What are the associations that you have
with each of those terms? So feel free to discuss them either
individually, or in complement to one each other, to one another, sorry.
>> Yes. >> There we are.
>> So, so Psychosocial aging processes can support healthy aging or not,
[LAUGH]. And I think one thing I have thought a
lot about, in both my professional and personal life.
>> Uh-mm. >> Is embracing aging as something that
is a good thing we don't have to fight aging, and we can stay young by
continuing to grow. And change and learn new things, without
fearing the aging process. So I think that, that is one of things
that I am most interested in, is helping people make peace with the idea of aging.
[COUGH], while not necessarily giving in to societal stereotypes of aging as being
a really bad thing, as being filled with inevitable suffering and so on.
So I think I'm interested in reframing aging as a, something that Andrew Weil
has talked about aging. As being a good thing for cheeses and
wines, why not for us? >> [LAUGH].
>> Then we can grow and mellow and richer.
>> Uh-hm. >> Well, and you know that is one of
the most common jokes in inside aging circles and that is, if cheese and wine
become better. Why don't we think of people getting
better with age? But I guess I'm kind of hearing an, and,
tell me what you really think about this. I'm really hearing that you're trying to
balance the stereotypical idea of aging and being old as a period of decline and
loss. >> Mm-hm.
>> With the idea that balanced against those declines and those specific losses
that we may all incur at various points throughout our lifespan.
>> Mm-hm. >> Are positive attributes, that we can
emphasize in balance with, or in harmony with.
>> Yes. So just like you wouldn't expect an 80
year old to be an Olympic gymnast. Because that's probably not possible.
[LAUGH] >> For a 50 year old for that matter.
>> [LAUGH]. But there are avenues and vistas that can
open up in the later years. And keeping yourself connected with
what's a ins, inspires you, what you feel passionate about, keeps the mind young.
I mean learning is the fountain of youth, it seems to me.
So, that growing and learning and changing and not resisting change, can be
a key ingredient, it seems to me, >> You know.
>> And I think staying young at heart. >> Mm-hm.
>> which doesn't necessarily mean denying the aging process.
But staying young and heart can actually help the body age well.
Can promote optimal aging. >> Uh-huh.
And can you say a little bit more about the denial of aging?
That seems to be a prominent kind of idea that we hear a great deal.
Particularly when, folks start talking about anti-aging.
>> Mm-hm. >> Or other phenomena, that are about
combating or fighting with. >> Right, and then it becomes a fear
thing, and it's this aging process. >> Mm-hm.
>> That number one's inevitable. So [LAUGH], there's a lot of futility in
fighting it in that way. So I think that it's actually more
effective to embrace aging in a way that optimizes strength and flexibility for
the body and the mind. >> Mm.
>> [LAUGH]. >> So Ellen Langer did an interesting
study some years ago where she took a group of older adults.
And put them in an, an environment that replicated the year 1959.
When this group of people were all still quite young, and so she found not only
did their energy levels increase and their behavior become more youth-like.
They actually experienced physiological changes associated with you know, growing
younger in a sense. So they were able to turn back the hands
of time slightly, not by fearing age, but just by embracing that part of
themselves. That they could still relate to in terms
of their own youthfulness. So I think there's the, so I think it's a
balancing act between accepting change in life and accepting the aging process.
While also embracing those parts of yourself that are still growing and new,
and fresh, and young. >> And that might be about how you
think about yourself, how you consider your relationships in your life.
And how you, living your community. >> Yes.
>> If you will. >> Yes, and look at how, years and
years ago, a grandma, if you think about what, if you think of an old, old woman
with white hair, with her hair pulled back in a bun, right?
>> So the stereotype, wrinkled skin, gray hair.
>> Of the grandma. Now, look at all the grandmothers in the
world, women today [LAUGH]. In the 21st century, who are living in a
really different way, and so I think it's possible to extend vibrancy in life
longer. >> Hm.
>> Without necessarily resisting the aging process.
>> Mm-hm. >> So, aging, there's also a component
of your social role. >> Yes.
>> And how other people are treating you.
>> Yes. >> As you age.
>> Absolutely, and I think it's really important to value.
older adults in our society, what they have to give to respect their perspective
and their experiences in life. Because lets face it, experience is
valuable. >> Uh-hm.
>> We do learn things as we grow older. And we're able, I think see things from a
different perspective. I remember I, I did some field work at a,
a continuing care retirement community. And one of the women, her response to one
of my questions has stuck with me all these years, this was many years ago.
And she said, do you know what's interesting?
At the end of my life, when I was going through it, nothing made sense.
And now,it's like it's a jigsaw puzzle. And I can see where all the pieces fit.
And she had this real sense of clarity and completion in retrospect that I
thought was really beautiful. And and I, and I thought.
What a valuable thing to share with me [LAUGH].
>> Yeah. What, what a great and elegant image.
>> Yeah. >> For what might be possible as we
think about greater balance. And knowing, building on Anne's point,
knowing your interest in looking across cultures and societies.
>> as we are asking our Old Globers, our old, Old Globe participants to really
get into a dialogue with each other and with us about Growing Older on the Globe.
>> Uh-huh. >> what are the sorts of cross cultural
things that we might emphasize in that dialogue when we think about
psychological and social aging. >> Well I think one thing that some
cultures do better than, than here in, in North America.
Is having really useful, good roles for older adults [LAUGH], in the societies.
For example, in traditional societies, the older adults would interact a lot
with the very young children in a community [LAUGH].
And here in, unfortunately, we have the tendency to isolate our older adults off
to the side, often institutionalizing them and not allowing them to share their
gifts of. Knowledge and experience and perspective
and someone And also cultural traditions, even, you
know, family heritage tradition and cultural heritage with, with younger
members of the community. And I think this, this kind of
segregation by age, diminishes society as a whole, but also the quality of life
for, for older adults. >> Mh-mm.
>> So it would be nice to learn how to better value what it is that older adults
do have to offer. >> Yeah, so in some ways, it's really
about rethinking social roles for our society.
>> That is aging and living in the 21st century.
>> Yes, and learning that older adults can be vibrant, active members of their
community in, in ways that are appropriate for them.
Like, again, right? >> So, new and different social roles.
>> Right. >> As well as revisiting, what we might
of thought of as valuable social roles. But decades ago.
>> Mm-hm. >> Excellent.
I think at that point you've really helped us to close our first week content
list and we really look forward to speaking with you more for week four.
>> Thank you so much. It's a pleasure to be here, [LAUGH].