1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:06,070 [MUSIC PLAYING] 2 00:00:06,071 --> 00:00:08,711 Whatever this thing is it's not traveling far. 3 00:00:08,715 --> 00:00:10,325 Will's body, it was a fake. 4 00:00:10,320 --> 00:00:12,700 I don't think my parents ever loved each other. 5 00:00:12,700 --> 00:00:13,200 [GUNSHOT] 6 00:00:13,200 --> 00:00:16,390 It's not safe. 7 00:00:16,392 --> 00:00:20,192 OK so hopefully, if you've done some blue skying, 8 00:00:20,190 --> 00:00:22,590 you've come up with some various characters 9 00:00:22,590 --> 00:00:27,810 just how like we did with 11 with our Sheriff Sam Rockwell 10 00:00:27,810 --> 00:00:28,720 character. 11 00:00:28,720 --> 00:00:30,460 So now that you've got all these, 12 00:00:30,460 --> 00:00:32,340 another thing that we often do is 13 00:00:32,340 --> 00:00:34,500 we start listing all the characters, 14 00:00:34,497 --> 00:00:36,577 the ones that we think are going to make the show. 15 00:00:36,580 --> 00:00:39,810 But again, even though we are going in a little more detail 16 00:00:39,810 --> 00:00:41,580 now by making a list of our characters, 17 00:00:41,580 --> 00:00:43,840 we want to start really broad. 18 00:00:43,840 --> 00:00:48,060 We don't want to get lost in the woods of too many details. 19 00:00:48,060 --> 00:00:51,030 So we're going to show you right now like the initial list we 20 00:00:51,030 --> 00:00:53,040 made of characters that we thought 21 00:00:53,040 --> 00:00:54,540 could be integral to this show. 22 00:00:54,540 --> 00:00:57,420 So as you see in this document, we've 23 00:00:57,420 --> 00:01:00,870 got kid who has taken, Tommy. 24 00:01:00,870 --> 00:01:01,870 That it becomes well. 25 00:01:01,870 --> 00:01:04,140 So some of these names did not stick. 26 00:01:04,140 --> 00:01:06,180 And again, I think the reason that 27 00:01:06,180 --> 00:01:08,340 is obviously the first character we wrote down. 28 00:01:08,340 --> 00:01:11,330 Why we know for a fact that character 29 00:01:11,325 --> 00:01:13,205 is going to make the show because the show is 30 00:01:13,200 --> 00:01:16,290 about the drive of the show is about a missing kid, right? 31 00:01:16,290 --> 00:01:18,720 Sometimes it's nice to throw some names out just 32 00:01:18,720 --> 00:01:20,230 to give you something to hook onto. 33 00:01:20,230 --> 00:01:23,850 We've got best friend Joel. 34 00:01:23,850 --> 00:01:26,550 Joel obviously will become Mike later on, 35 00:01:26,550 --> 00:01:29,700 nerd friend, Neil, who eventually becomes Lucas. 36 00:01:29,700 --> 00:01:30,630 Yeah. 37 00:01:30,630 --> 00:01:34,710 We've got overweight friend, Dustin, Joel's parents, 38 00:01:34,710 --> 00:01:36,690 we don't go into any detail about them. 39 00:01:36,690 --> 00:01:39,060 Joyce and Guy, I mean, his name is Guy. 40 00:01:39,060 --> 00:01:41,220 That's how vague this is right now. 41 00:01:41,220 --> 00:01:44,300 We've got Tommy's parents, Tommy being- 42 00:01:44,295 --> 00:01:45,375 Is Will. 43 00:01:45,370 --> 00:01:47,370 So Joyce, we obviously switched. 44 00:01:47,370 --> 00:01:49,710 Again, all of these names are on Wendy, Arthur. 45 00:01:49,710 --> 00:01:52,740 Sheriff, we went into a lot of detail there, Sheriff's 46 00:01:52,740 --> 00:01:55,310 pregnant wife, she obviously didn't make the show. 47 00:01:55,305 --> 00:01:57,185 Not all these characters are going to come up 48 00:01:57,180 --> 00:01:58,700 with are going to make it. 49 00:01:58,703 --> 00:02:00,123 As you continue to develop, you're 50 00:02:00,120 --> 00:02:02,730 going to see who's going to make it 51 00:02:02,730 --> 00:02:05,310 in who's essential to the plot and who's not. 52 00:02:05,310 --> 00:02:07,110 We've got Sheriff's daughter. 53 00:02:07,110 --> 00:02:09,310 That character obviously didn't make it. 54 00:02:09,310 --> 00:02:13,530 We've got escapee, which was eventually 55 00:02:13,530 --> 00:02:18,070 becomes 11, the escapee from the lab. 56 00:02:18,070 --> 00:02:21,060 So again, baby steps, we're starting very small. 57 00:02:21,060 --> 00:02:24,090 We're just going these are some of the characters who might 58 00:02:24,090 --> 00:02:26,250 make it in terms of the names. 59 00:02:26,250 --> 00:02:27,810 That can be a fun detour. 60 00:02:27,810 --> 00:02:29,130 You're hitting a wall. 61 00:02:29,130 --> 00:02:32,100 You're getting sort of tired of blue skying in it. 62 00:02:32,100 --> 00:02:33,840 One thing we like to go is we'll just go 63 00:02:33,840 --> 00:02:36,750 into like Social Security site. 64 00:02:36,750 --> 00:02:39,930 And we'll punch in, we'll figure out 65 00:02:39,930 --> 00:02:42,510 do the quick little math in terms of what 66 00:02:42,510 --> 00:02:45,210 when these kids would be born. 67 00:02:45,210 --> 00:02:48,360 So in the case of this, it was like sometime in the '70s. 68 00:02:48,357 --> 00:02:49,437 And we would just type in. 69 00:02:49,440 --> 00:02:50,580 And then you can choose. 70 00:02:50,580 --> 00:02:55,740 You can go top 1,000 names from 1972. 71 00:02:55,740 --> 00:02:58,140 And you're going to get a list starting with most 72 00:02:58,140 --> 00:03:00,000 common to least common names. 73 00:03:00,000 --> 00:03:03,690 And you can start to look through and make sure. 74 00:03:03,685 --> 00:03:06,065 First of all, you make sure the names are period correct. 75 00:03:06,060 --> 00:03:09,480 And also you can start to assign names to your characters. 76 00:03:09,480 --> 00:03:12,450 Now, obviously the names we assigned here did not stick. 77 00:03:12,450 --> 00:03:14,890 But it can start to give you a little hook 78 00:03:14,893 --> 00:03:15,813 into these characters. 79 00:03:15,810 --> 00:03:16,600 Yeah, it's funny. 80 00:03:16,602 --> 00:03:19,652 Again how oh, you just seem like a Matt. 81 00:03:19,650 --> 00:03:22,620 You just seem like a Trevor, a Lee. 82 00:03:22,620 --> 00:03:25,170 A name does kind of give you some sense, 83 00:03:25,170 --> 00:03:27,510 or you might have an impression of someone what someone 84 00:03:27,510 --> 00:03:28,990 is like with a specific name. 85 00:03:28,990 --> 00:03:31,080 It's a small thing, but actually does help 86 00:03:31,080 --> 00:03:34,760 provide very early little bits of definition 87 00:03:34,757 --> 00:03:36,337 as you're starting with the character. 88 00:03:36,340 --> 00:03:38,630 In shorthand if you're working with a writing partner 89 00:03:38,632 --> 00:03:39,382 to talk about it. 90 00:03:39,385 --> 00:03:40,765 Hey, so Joel is going to go here. 91 00:03:40,760 --> 00:03:41,460 And then Joel is going to go here. 92 00:03:41,460 --> 00:03:42,130 Yeah, exactly. 93 00:03:42,127 --> 00:03:44,607 That's it's just a shorthand for you to do. 94 00:03:44,610 --> 00:03:46,600 You're just trying to come up with who 95 00:03:46,597 --> 00:03:48,927 are some characters that might populate this story-line. 96 00:03:48,930 --> 00:03:54,850 [MUSIC PLAYING] 97 00:03:54,846 --> 00:03:58,726 In terms of deciding which characters are really 98 00:03:58,723 --> 00:04:00,143 going to make it, which characters 99 00:04:00,140 --> 00:04:01,490 are going to become essential to the show, 100 00:04:01,490 --> 00:04:03,220 Ross touched on this a little bit before. 101 00:04:03,222 --> 00:04:05,182 You've got to start with the most obvious ones. 102 00:04:05,180 --> 00:04:07,010 In this case, we obviously the show 103 00:04:07,010 --> 00:04:09,740 does not exist without the kid who goes missing. 104 00:04:09,740 --> 00:04:11,520 Then you work from there. 105 00:04:11,520 --> 00:04:13,550 We knew he was going to have friends who are 106 00:04:13,550 --> 00:04:14,720 going to be looking for him. 107 00:04:14,717 --> 00:04:16,517 So we know those friends are going to exist 108 00:04:16,517 --> 00:04:17,597 and be a part of the show. 109 00:04:17,600 --> 00:04:19,430 We know there's going to be a Sheriff a part 110 00:04:19,430 --> 00:04:21,350 of the show who's looking for the missing kid. 111 00:04:21,347 --> 00:04:24,467 We know the kid's friends, the missing kid 112 00:04:24,470 --> 00:04:26,560 is going to have a family. 113 00:04:26,562 --> 00:04:28,522 We know he's going to have a mother who's going 114 00:04:28,520 --> 00:04:29,600 to be a central character. 115 00:04:29,603 --> 00:04:30,983 So you just start working there. 116 00:04:30,980 --> 00:04:33,110 And the story itself will dictate 117 00:04:33,110 --> 00:04:35,890 which characters are essential. 118 00:04:35,892 --> 00:04:37,852 Once we started to think these characters are 119 00:04:37,850 --> 00:04:40,440 going to make it, we go into a little more detail. 120 00:04:40,440 --> 00:04:43,220 We've got Joyce Byers, Will's mom. 121 00:04:43,220 --> 00:04:44,930 OK, she's now switched we. 122 00:04:44,930 --> 00:04:45,760 We got the name. 123 00:04:45,763 --> 00:04:47,183 We got the name right this time. 124 00:04:47,180 --> 00:04:48,710 And even the last name, actually, 125 00:04:48,710 --> 00:04:52,420 once you're confident that a character is going to survive 126 00:04:52,423 --> 00:04:54,593 and you're going to exist within your show, it's fun 127 00:04:54,590 --> 00:04:55,630 to give them a last name. 128 00:04:55,632 --> 00:04:57,832 It starts to again, just help give them 129 00:04:57,830 --> 00:04:59,240 an identity in your head. 130 00:04:59,240 --> 00:05:01,100 So you started really broad, and now we're 131 00:05:01,100 --> 00:05:03,230 going into just a little more detail. 132 00:05:03,230 --> 00:05:07,760 We're saying Will's mom, single, husband left a long time ago. 133 00:05:07,760 --> 00:05:10,370 That's all, he's a deadbeat. 134 00:05:10,370 --> 00:05:14,540 Drug addict we say maybe she has an older daughter, ellipses. 135 00:05:14,540 --> 00:05:16,730 And then we go into the older daughter character, 136 00:05:16,730 --> 00:05:19,070 Vicki Byers, very pretty, beginning 137 00:05:19,070 --> 00:05:23,840 of trouble at a young age, 16, in with a bad group, 138 00:05:23,840 --> 00:05:27,290 a group of older kids who pick on our hero kids. 139 00:05:27,290 --> 00:05:31,400 We then say Billy Flanagan, high school bully, 140 00:05:31,400 --> 00:05:33,680 Vickie's boyfriend, leader of a group of friends, 141 00:05:33,680 --> 00:05:36,230 trouble makes fun of our kids, dangerous, 142 00:05:36,230 --> 00:05:39,200 gets a knife, et cetera, the evil side of our town. 143 00:05:39,200 --> 00:05:41,690 Now, the reason I'm sharing these two with you 144 00:05:41,690 --> 00:05:44,570 is because elements of these characters made 145 00:05:44,570 --> 00:05:46,730 into the show, these specific characters 146 00:05:46,730 --> 00:05:49,070 did not make it into season one. 147 00:05:49,070 --> 00:05:52,790 Vickie Byers a version of that became Nancy. 148 00:05:52,790 --> 00:05:54,950 So we didn't give Joyce a daughter anymore. 149 00:05:54,950 --> 00:05:57,830 And parts of Vickie ended up moving over 150 00:05:57,830 --> 00:06:02,090 to Nancy in that she's the nice girl, 151 00:06:02,090 --> 00:06:05,300 but she gets sort of drawn into a slightly darker 152 00:06:05,300 --> 00:06:06,800 side with Steve. 153 00:06:06,800 --> 00:06:10,790 The Billy Flanagan character, Billy ends up playing a role, 154 00:06:10,790 --> 00:06:13,040 a Billy character very similar to this 155 00:06:13,040 --> 00:06:15,550 ends up playing a role in season two. 156 00:06:15,545 --> 00:06:17,195 And we keep that name, actually. 157 00:06:17,190 --> 00:06:22,790 We do keep that name but some of this of Steve 158 00:06:22,790 --> 00:06:24,370 is softened a bit. 159 00:06:24,373 --> 00:06:25,793 But even in the original pilot, he 160 00:06:25,790 --> 00:06:28,340 is a little scarier, a little more dangerous, more 161 00:06:28,340 --> 00:06:29,040 of a bully. 162 00:06:29,040 --> 00:06:32,900 So some of these elements from this Billy Flanagan character 163 00:06:32,900 --> 00:06:34,940 became Steve. 164 00:06:34,940 --> 00:06:38,090 So Vicki and Billy were like very early prototypes 165 00:06:38,090 --> 00:06:41,420 for who would become, what would become Nancy and Steve. 166 00:06:41,420 --> 00:06:45,960 And again, just like with blue sky, just like your big idea, 167 00:06:45,960 --> 00:06:48,770 and none of this is it's all useful to have all of this. 168 00:06:48,770 --> 00:06:51,560 And obviously, we felt pretty confident at this stage 169 00:06:51,563 --> 00:06:53,483 that these characters would make it because we 170 00:06:53,480 --> 00:06:54,620 started fleshing them out. 171 00:06:54,620 --> 00:06:55,790 They obviously didn't. 172 00:06:55,790 --> 00:06:56,680 That's OK. 173 00:06:56,680 --> 00:06:58,700 You're in the story is going to keep evolving, 174 00:06:58,700 --> 00:07:00,830 and stuff's going to get pushed to the side. 175 00:07:00,830 --> 00:07:02,410 And that's just part of the process. 176 00:07:02,405 --> 00:07:08,945 [MUSIC PLAYING] 177 00:07:08,942 --> 00:07:10,772 So again, you've started out really broad. 178 00:07:10,775 --> 00:07:13,465 You have a really rough list of the characters, you think. 179 00:07:13,460 --> 00:07:15,710 And once you're more confident, which 180 00:07:15,710 --> 00:07:18,030 ones are going to make it into the show, 181 00:07:18,032 --> 00:07:19,492 you should start fleshing them out. 182 00:07:19,490 --> 00:07:21,140 You should start to zoom in on them. 183 00:07:21,140 --> 00:07:22,380 Explore that character. 184 00:07:22,380 --> 00:07:24,050 I think as you explore that character, 185 00:07:24,050 --> 00:07:26,280 it'll illuminate more whether or not 186 00:07:26,275 --> 00:07:27,655 they're worth having in the show, 187 00:07:27,650 --> 00:07:29,360 whether or not they're interesting enough 188 00:07:29,358 --> 00:07:31,098 to be a major character in your show. 189 00:07:31,100 --> 00:07:34,440 So one of the characters, we are fairly confident early on. 190 00:07:34,442 --> 00:07:35,402 I mean, you never know. 191 00:07:35,400 --> 00:07:39,200 But we were pretty confident the Sheriff character ultimately 192 00:07:39,200 --> 00:07:41,480 would become Chief Hopper, that Hopper 193 00:07:41,480 --> 00:07:43,010 was going to be a part of the show 194 00:07:43,005 --> 00:07:44,635 that we were going to have the Sheriff. 195 00:07:44,630 --> 00:07:47,270 And so we started to really flesh him out. 196 00:07:47,270 --> 00:07:49,040 So you can actually see, we started 197 00:07:49,040 --> 00:07:51,890 to sketch him out a little bit beyond remember 198 00:07:51,890 --> 00:07:55,730 he started out just Sam Rockwell not McConaughey 199 00:07:55,732 --> 00:07:56,692 on a beach [INAUDIBLE]. 200 00:07:56,690 --> 00:07:59,300 So then we took that, and now we've suggested maybe-- 201 00:07:59,300 --> 00:08:01,820 Had a Sheriff which is not any more 202 00:08:01,820 --> 00:08:03,170 detailed than Sam Rockwell. 203 00:08:03,170 --> 00:08:06,860 And now, we're like OK, let's actually 204 00:08:06,860 --> 00:08:08,900 give this guy a little more of a backstory, 205 00:08:08,900 --> 00:08:10,730 a little bit of a dramatic hat. 206 00:08:10,730 --> 00:08:12,480 So and some of this, yeah OK let's see. 207 00:08:12,482 --> 00:08:13,192 It's interesting. 208 00:08:13,190 --> 00:08:15,870 So we said maybe it was a family man in New York. 209 00:08:15,870 --> 00:08:17,240 His son died, car accident. 210 00:08:17,240 --> 00:08:19,520 Now he's fucked up, left the city to come here, 211 00:08:19,520 --> 00:08:21,560 pictures of family and house, lives 212 00:08:21,560 --> 00:08:23,930 in a shack near the beach, this was Montauk, still, 213 00:08:23,930 --> 00:08:26,870 drinks too much, smokes too much, 214 00:08:26,870 --> 00:08:31,130 over a course of series falls for Joyce who is also broken, 215 00:08:31,130 --> 00:08:34,640 comes to terms with his past as he solves her son's murder. 216 00:08:34,640 --> 00:08:37,550 So actually, that's all spot on, really. 217 00:08:37,549 --> 00:08:40,579 In terms of Hopper, obviously, we switched his son 218 00:08:40,580 --> 00:08:43,720 and made that a daughter, but the rest of it is true. 219 00:08:43,723 --> 00:08:45,143 So what we were doing with Hopper, 220 00:08:45,140 --> 00:08:47,900 and I remember actually as we were working on 221 00:08:47,900 --> 00:08:48,770 like really early. 222 00:08:48,770 --> 00:08:51,260 This was probably even pre the Sam Rockwell epiphany, 223 00:08:51,263 --> 00:08:53,183 is that he was really going to be more modeled 224 00:08:53,180 --> 00:08:55,190 after Chief Brody in Jaws, that he 225 00:08:55,190 --> 00:08:57,800 was going to be kind of a family man Sheriff, and then. 226 00:08:57,800 --> 00:09:00,300 That's why we the wife in the all of that. 227 00:09:00,300 --> 00:09:03,590 But then looking at how this was going to be a TV show, 228 00:09:03,590 --> 00:09:05,780 we wanted to do something a little bit more 229 00:09:05,775 --> 00:09:06,905 with the Sheriff character. 230 00:09:06,900 --> 00:09:08,670 We also didn't want to copy Jaws. 231 00:09:08,670 --> 00:09:10,110 We want to do something different. 232 00:09:10,110 --> 00:09:13,520 And so we wanted to give him more 233 00:09:13,520 --> 00:09:17,330 of an interesting complex backstory. 234 00:09:17,330 --> 00:09:19,850 And that's where we, and so suddenly, 235 00:09:19,850 --> 00:09:21,650 he no longer has a pregnant wife. 236 00:09:21,650 --> 00:09:24,860 He has a wife who he's divorced from or estranged from. 237 00:09:24,860 --> 00:09:28,580 And he had, they had a daughter together who died. 238 00:09:28,580 --> 00:09:30,500 And that, what we liked about that is it 239 00:09:30,500 --> 00:09:32,660 gave us real emotional stakes in terms 240 00:09:32,660 --> 00:09:36,010 of this, what's happening now in the present day in terms 241 00:09:36,010 --> 00:09:38,510 of the investigation, in terms of the search for the missing 242 00:09:38,510 --> 00:09:39,770 boy, in search of Will. 243 00:09:39,770 --> 00:09:41,660 He's lost a child, so suddenly, it 244 00:09:41,660 --> 00:09:44,480 takes on more meaning to him, the search 245 00:09:44,480 --> 00:09:46,070 for the search for Will. 246 00:09:46,070 --> 00:09:49,980 That, of course, leads naturally to a connection with Joyce, 247 00:09:49,980 --> 00:09:50,480 right? 248 00:09:50,480 --> 00:09:51,620 Because she's lost her son. 249 00:09:51,620 --> 00:09:55,400 So they have both lost a child, and perhaps he 250 00:09:55,400 --> 00:09:58,050 thinks in bringing her, saving her child, 251 00:09:58,050 --> 00:09:59,660 he can kind of sort of redeem himself. 252 00:09:59,660 --> 00:10:01,760 So suddenly, we're like OK that's a character. 253 00:10:01,760 --> 00:10:03,890 That's a fully fleshed out are and we've 254 00:10:03,890 --> 00:10:05,690 got an anchor so we sort of we're 255 00:10:05,690 --> 00:10:07,400 starting to understand who Hopper is. 256 00:10:07,400 --> 00:10:10,970 So we also do this with other characters, but not all of them 257 00:10:10,965 --> 00:10:11,845 are that fleshed out. 258 00:10:11,840 --> 00:10:16,040 That came to us, and obviously, this all mostly stuck. 259 00:10:16,040 --> 00:10:20,510 Other characters let's look at like our description of Lucas, 260 00:10:20,510 --> 00:10:22,670 nerd dungeon master, dresses in black, 261 00:10:22,670 --> 00:10:27,360 glasses, LOTR, that's Lord of the Rings, fantasy books, 262 00:10:27,360 --> 00:10:29,810 video games, unkempt. 263 00:10:29,810 --> 00:10:32,660 That's nothing really like the Lucas that is in the show 264 00:10:32,660 --> 00:10:33,200 at all. 265 00:10:33,200 --> 00:10:35,840 Dustin, we describe as diminutive. 266 00:10:35,840 --> 00:10:39,230 I mean, there's not much else we're talking about Dustin. 267 00:10:39,230 --> 00:10:43,250 This is not-- these are not very evolved characters, not 268 00:10:43,250 --> 00:10:44,970 in the same way that Hopper is. 269 00:10:44,968 --> 00:10:46,758 And that's OK, because sometimes this stuff 270 00:10:46,760 --> 00:10:49,640 is going to come very quickly like hopper clearly 271 00:10:49,640 --> 00:10:53,810 in a quick little brainstorming session as is documented here. 272 00:10:53,810 --> 00:10:56,200 We got his whole backstory, and we got his arc. 273 00:10:56,203 --> 00:10:58,373 That is not going to be the case of every character, 274 00:10:58,370 --> 00:11:00,110 and you don't want to beat yourself up 275 00:11:00,110 --> 00:11:01,320 because that's not the case. 276 00:11:01,320 --> 00:11:01,720 It's OK. 277 00:11:01,715 --> 00:11:03,415 So some of this is not going to be right, 278 00:11:03,410 --> 00:11:04,700 but you've got to throw it out. 279 00:11:04,702 --> 00:11:06,932 And the stuff that stick is sticks is going to stick. 280 00:11:06,930 --> 00:11:08,930 And stuff that doesn't is just going to go away. 281 00:11:08,930 --> 00:11:10,500 Again, it's nobody's going to read this. 282 00:11:10,500 --> 00:11:11,010 It doesn't matter. 283 00:11:11,010 --> 00:11:11,510 Yeah. 284 00:11:11,510 --> 00:11:17,290 [MUSIC PLAYING] 285 00:11:17,290 --> 00:11:20,860 When you're working on these characters and developing it, 286 00:11:20,860 --> 00:11:23,440 one good thing to do that, we do a lot 287 00:11:23,440 --> 00:11:25,750 is we mind our own lives, whether it's 288 00:11:25,750 --> 00:11:29,080 childhood or the life we're living now and looking 289 00:11:29,080 --> 00:11:33,220 at our friends or personalities that we in trying 290 00:11:33,220 --> 00:11:35,260 to be inspired by that. 291 00:11:35,260 --> 00:11:39,520 And because you really want these characters to feel real. 292 00:11:39,520 --> 00:11:42,400 And so I think that can really help flesh 293 00:11:42,400 --> 00:11:45,340 a character out is just looking at your own life. 294 00:11:45,340 --> 00:11:47,170 I think Joyce initially started out 295 00:11:47,170 --> 00:11:49,360 a lot more like our mom. 296 00:11:49,360 --> 00:11:51,760 I think that was the initial sort of prototype 297 00:11:51,760 --> 00:11:55,600 is we were basing her a little bit more on our mom. 298 00:11:55,600 --> 00:11:57,940 And some of the friends were based on Dustin 299 00:11:57,940 --> 00:12:00,080 and stuff were based on our friends growing up, 300 00:12:00,080 --> 00:12:01,600 little kernels of them, right? 301 00:12:01,600 --> 00:12:02,950 So that helps. 302 00:12:02,950 --> 00:12:06,610 Sometimes it helps to give them a physical characteristic, 303 00:12:06,610 --> 00:12:08,990 I mean, anything that will help you see them, 304 00:12:08,985 --> 00:12:10,365 start to think about what they're 305 00:12:10,360 --> 00:12:13,120 interested in, what they like. 306 00:12:13,120 --> 00:12:15,970 And specific things can help. 307 00:12:15,970 --> 00:12:19,060 So if you look at this example for Mike, so we said he's shy. 308 00:12:19,060 --> 00:12:21,820 We said birthmark along his neck, face, 309 00:12:21,820 --> 00:12:23,770 kids make fun of him for it, so that's, 310 00:12:23,770 --> 00:12:26,190 we're starting to get actually a little bit more specific. 311 00:12:26,187 --> 00:12:28,477 Whether it's physical, or it could be a stutter, 312 00:12:28,475 --> 00:12:30,105 it could be a million different things. 313 00:12:30,100 --> 00:12:32,410 But sometimes that can be a shorthand 314 00:12:32,410 --> 00:12:34,720 for the audience to start to understand 315 00:12:34,720 --> 00:12:36,110 who this character is. 316 00:12:36,112 --> 00:12:37,572 And then as we moved into the show, 317 00:12:37,570 --> 00:12:40,390 we realized we didn't need that to define Mike. 318 00:12:40,390 --> 00:12:42,700 And I would also say in terms of the shy, 319 00:12:42,700 --> 00:12:46,210 we originally basing him a lot on sort of us we were 320 00:12:46,210 --> 00:12:48,470 pretty shy kids growing up. 321 00:12:48,470 --> 00:12:51,040 And so I think it was a shorthand for us 322 00:12:51,040 --> 00:12:52,480 to write that character. 323 00:12:52,480 --> 00:12:55,690 Then we see Finn Wolfhard's audition, it evolves. 324 00:12:55,690 --> 00:12:56,980 Finn is not a shy kid. 325 00:12:56,980 --> 00:12:58,000 That character evolves. 326 00:12:58,000 --> 00:12:59,620 And I think it evolves into something 327 00:12:59,620 --> 00:13:02,200 that was more interesting, more specific to the show. 328 00:13:02,200 --> 00:13:04,760 But it's OK to start with your life. 329 00:13:04,762 --> 00:13:06,972 And you can always let it evolve either in the script 330 00:13:06,970 --> 00:13:10,170 or pass the script once you actually move into production. 331 00:13:10,165 --> 00:13:16,165 [MUSIC PLAYING] 332 00:13:16,162 --> 00:13:22,212 So just as your story is going to have sort of go from A to B, 333 00:13:22,210 --> 00:13:25,390 Will's missing we got to find Will. 334 00:13:25,390 --> 00:13:28,570 So you've got a drive, and you're going to have obstacles 335 00:13:28,565 --> 00:13:29,445 along the way, right? 336 00:13:29,440 --> 00:13:32,510 You're going from one point to another point. 337 00:13:32,507 --> 00:13:34,087 And again, there are going to be a lot 338 00:13:34,090 --> 00:13:37,550 of little points between Will missing and finding Will. 339 00:13:37,545 --> 00:13:38,925 Otherwise, you don't have a show. 340 00:13:38,920 --> 00:13:41,020 So there's going to be a lot of stuff in between. 341 00:13:41,020 --> 00:13:43,270 But it's important to know where you're going with it. 342 00:13:43,270 --> 00:13:45,130 And it's the same with the characters. 343 00:13:45,130 --> 00:13:48,700 Mike starts off as shy, not very confident. 344 00:13:48,700 --> 00:13:51,100 He falls in love, comes of age. 345 00:13:51,100 --> 00:13:54,370 It's a very broad character arc, but it is the character arc. 346 00:13:54,370 --> 00:13:58,570 Hopper is broken due to the death of his daughter. 347 00:13:58,570 --> 00:14:02,080 By finding Will, he's able to find some sort of redemption 348 00:14:02,080 --> 00:14:03,100 for himself. 349 00:14:03,100 --> 00:14:04,810 And he's able to find himself again. 350 00:14:04,810 --> 00:14:07,150 That is a very simple arc. 351 00:14:07,150 --> 00:14:10,510 And I think again, you're going to want to pick the characters. 352 00:14:10,510 --> 00:14:13,960 You can't give everyone this incredible arc. 353 00:14:13,960 --> 00:14:16,810 We have a ton of side characters in Stranger Things 354 00:14:16,810 --> 00:14:18,140 that don't have a big arc. 355 00:14:18,140 --> 00:14:20,140 The arcs aren't going to feel satisfying or earn 356 00:14:20,140 --> 00:14:22,470 because you're trying to give everyone this amazing arc. 357 00:14:22,473 --> 00:14:24,583 But at that point, what ends up happening is 358 00:14:24,580 --> 00:14:26,020 or we find happening is you end up 359 00:14:26,020 --> 00:14:31,110 shortchanging the characters who you want to have this. 360 00:14:31,108 --> 00:14:32,648 You have the great arc plan for them. 361 00:14:32,650 --> 00:14:35,110 You're just going to end up shortchanging those characters. 362 00:14:35,108 --> 00:14:38,038 So it's important to focus on the ones who are really 363 00:14:38,042 --> 00:14:39,252 essential in terms of arcing. 364 00:14:39,250 --> 00:14:41,080 And the other characters are going to be great characters. 365 00:14:41,080 --> 00:14:42,910 They just might not have this sort 366 00:14:42,910 --> 00:14:46,540 of grand emotional arc in the same way 367 00:14:46,540 --> 00:14:48,880 that Hopper does or Joyce or whatever. 368 00:14:48,880 --> 00:14:52,360 And of the kids, we gave Mike the biggest arc 369 00:14:52,360 --> 00:14:53,920 in terms of him coming of age. 370 00:14:53,920 --> 00:14:58,780 But for Lucas and Dustin, their arc is even much simpler than 371 00:14:58,780 --> 00:14:59,320 Mike's. 372 00:14:59,320 --> 00:15:02,170 We don't have time for them to go through that full journey 373 00:15:02,170 --> 00:15:04,300 that Mike does in season one. 374 00:15:04,300 --> 00:15:05,680 They fall apart. 375 00:15:05,680 --> 00:15:08,350 Their friendship breaks apart, and they're able to mend it. 376 00:15:08,350 --> 00:15:10,780 I mean, Dustin kind of starts like nerdy and awesome 377 00:15:10,780 --> 00:15:12,820 and he kind of is a nerdy and awesome at the end 378 00:15:12,820 --> 00:15:15,460 even though he's still confident in who he is. 379 00:15:15,460 --> 00:15:17,860 So you know, he doesn't have a big arc, 380 00:15:17,863 --> 00:15:19,283 but he's a really great character. 381 00:15:19,280 --> 00:15:21,160 But you're going to want to pick and choose 382 00:15:21,155 --> 00:15:23,895 which of those characters you want to give full arcs to. 383 00:15:23,890 --> 00:15:29,580 [MUSIC PLAYING] 384 00:15:29,578 --> 00:15:32,278 So you're going to have these arcs or some of them 385 00:15:32,280 --> 00:15:36,750 right now where you're A to B, we 386 00:15:36,748 --> 00:15:38,288 know where Hopper is going to end up. 387 00:15:38,290 --> 00:15:40,420 We know where we want Joyce to go. 388 00:15:40,420 --> 00:15:42,420 We know where we were on Lucas and Dustin to go. 389 00:15:42,420 --> 00:15:45,420 We know where we want Mike and 11 to go, just roughly, A 390 00:15:45,420 --> 00:15:47,940 to B. We don't know the journey, but we know roughly 391 00:15:47,940 --> 00:15:49,980 where we want them to start and end up. 392 00:15:49,980 --> 00:15:52,470 So what's interesting about writing a pilot script is 393 00:15:52,470 --> 00:15:55,750 you're just doing the A. Their journey is just beginning, 394 00:15:55,750 --> 00:15:57,460 you can't get them to be. 395 00:15:57,460 --> 00:16:00,690 So for instance, Hopper, right, we set up 396 00:16:00,690 --> 00:16:02,880 that he's popping Tuinal. 397 00:16:02,880 --> 00:16:05,610 But we wait until the end of that pilot script 398 00:16:05,610 --> 00:16:08,100 to even reveal that he had had a family 399 00:16:08,100 --> 00:16:09,630 and that his daughter had died. 400 00:16:09,630 --> 00:16:12,600 And we use that as oh wait, there's more to this character 401 00:16:12,600 --> 00:16:13,890 than I thought. 402 00:16:13,890 --> 00:16:16,060 But we don't even explore it. 403 00:16:16,060 --> 00:16:17,880 We just tell you, the audience that 404 00:16:17,880 --> 00:16:19,380 at the very end of the episode. 405 00:16:19,380 --> 00:16:22,120 And then we know, and anyone reading the script 406 00:16:22,122 --> 00:16:22,832 is going to know. 407 00:16:22,830 --> 00:16:25,050 Oh, this is an important part of this character, 408 00:16:25,050 --> 00:16:27,460 and I know they're going to continue to explore it. 409 00:16:27,460 --> 00:16:28,980 But don't race it. 410 00:16:28,980 --> 00:16:31,690 Really, we're just setting up who these people, are 411 00:16:31,692 --> 00:16:33,402 and we're starting them on their journey. 412 00:16:33,400 --> 00:16:35,850 But that arc for Mike for instance, 413 00:16:35,850 --> 00:16:37,840 he meets 11 at the ending of the pilot. 414 00:16:37,840 --> 00:16:39,420 He's not coming of age yet. 415 00:16:39,420 --> 00:16:41,220 He's just meeting the person that's 416 00:16:41,220 --> 00:16:42,360 going to change his life. 417 00:16:42,360 --> 00:16:44,070 But we don't know how she's going to change his life. 418 00:16:44,070 --> 00:16:45,570 We don't know that she's going to change his life. 419 00:16:45,570 --> 00:16:46,560 We don't know that. 420 00:16:46,560 --> 00:16:49,240 So we're just starting them off on their journey. 421 00:16:49,240 --> 00:16:51,520 So I think sometimes, and this has happened with us. 422 00:16:51,520 --> 00:16:54,030 We want to race along too far. 423 00:16:54,030 --> 00:16:56,820 Lucas and Dustin are best friends still in the pilot. 424 00:16:56,820 --> 00:16:59,470 We haven't even hinted at any discord between them. 425 00:16:59,467 --> 00:17:00,297 We're going to wait. 426 00:17:00,300 --> 00:17:02,190 I think it is a big mistake that some people make 427 00:17:02,190 --> 00:17:04,110 in terms of, and we make it all the time. 428 00:17:04,109 --> 00:17:06,419 We have to keep reminding ourselves simplify, simplify, 429 00:17:06,420 --> 00:17:06,920 simplify. 430 00:17:06,920 --> 00:17:07,530 Slow down. 431 00:17:07,530 --> 00:17:09,090 And slow down. 432 00:17:09,089 --> 00:17:10,829 You get very excited, and you try 433 00:17:10,829 --> 00:17:14,699 to cram way too much into a single script, just, 434 00:17:14,700 --> 00:17:16,440 and everyone's always they're worried 435 00:17:16,440 --> 00:17:17,400 about they want to get across. 436 00:17:17,400 --> 00:17:19,690 They want to get across that this is a great character. 437 00:17:19,692 --> 00:17:22,832 They want to get across yeah, you want to tell everything, 438 00:17:22,829 --> 00:17:24,269 all your ideas about Hopper. 439 00:17:24,270 --> 00:17:24,960 Slow down. 440 00:17:24,960 --> 00:17:25,800 You have time. 441 00:17:25,800 --> 00:17:27,420 It gets going to get overwhelming, 442 00:17:27,420 --> 00:17:28,920 and the script is not going to work, 443 00:17:28,920 --> 00:17:31,590 so just a little bit at a time. 444 00:17:31,590 --> 00:17:32,910 Simplicity is your friend. 445 00:17:32,910 --> 00:17:35,000 Yeah, this is just step one of many steps. 446 00:17:34,995 --> 00:17:35,705 Yeah. 447 00:17:35,700 --> 00:17:41,770 [MUSIC PLAYING] 448 00:17:41,771 --> 00:17:44,101 In terms of when we're developing characters, I mean, 449 00:17:44,100 --> 00:17:45,520 there's a lot of tricks we can do. 450 00:17:45,517 --> 00:17:47,907 Like we said, we pull a lot from our lives 451 00:17:47,910 --> 00:17:49,650 and from people we know. 452 00:17:49,650 --> 00:17:52,710 And then there's also something that's, I don't know, 453 00:17:52,710 --> 00:17:54,690 it's been effective for us in terms of we 454 00:17:54,690 --> 00:17:58,800 take a character who is a stereotype, 455 00:17:58,800 --> 00:18:01,020 the jock, the cheerleader. 456 00:18:01,020 --> 00:18:01,830 The nerd. 457 00:18:01,830 --> 00:18:05,880 The nerd or whatever like Steve whatever 458 00:18:05,880 --> 00:18:08,730 is the perfect example or Nancy is a good example of something 459 00:18:08,730 --> 00:18:10,770 who starts out of this stereotype, someone 460 00:18:10,770 --> 00:18:12,970 who the audience thinks that they know. 461 00:18:12,970 --> 00:18:14,970 The good thing about that is immediately you go, 462 00:18:14,970 --> 00:18:16,830 OK, I think I know who this person is. 463 00:18:16,832 --> 00:18:17,792 So they're comfortable. 464 00:18:17,790 --> 00:18:20,820 They're like, OK, this is the douche bag jock, right? 465 00:18:20,820 --> 00:18:22,600 And then you flip that on its head. 466 00:18:22,600 --> 00:18:25,420 So you go wait, there's more to this character than you think. 467 00:18:25,423 --> 00:18:27,093 This is something that John Hughes who's 468 00:18:27,090 --> 00:18:29,220 a writer director we obviously look up to a lot 469 00:18:29,220 --> 00:18:30,150 did all the time. 470 00:18:30,150 --> 00:18:31,710 I mean, it's the classic Breakfast Club thing. 471 00:18:31,710 --> 00:18:32,960 You meet all these characters. 472 00:18:32,960 --> 00:18:34,830 You have each of the characters assumes 473 00:18:34,830 --> 00:18:36,300 they know the other character based 474 00:18:36,300 --> 00:18:38,720 on these stereotypes, these assumptions that they've made. 475 00:18:38,718 --> 00:18:40,258 And then over the course of the film, 476 00:18:40,260 --> 00:18:41,460 you kind of peel back those layers, 477 00:18:41,460 --> 00:18:43,170 and you realize there's a lot more to them. 478 00:18:43,170 --> 00:18:45,210 What it does is it gives the audience something 479 00:18:45,212 --> 00:18:47,612 to hook onto and go, OK, that's the nerd. 480 00:18:47,610 --> 00:18:49,080 That's the cheerleader. 481 00:18:49,080 --> 00:18:50,860 That's the douchebag boyfriend. 482 00:18:50,862 --> 00:18:51,572 That's the thing. 483 00:18:51,570 --> 00:18:54,990 But what we like to do is real life isn't that simple. 484 00:18:54,990 --> 00:18:56,910 No one can be that easily defined. 485 00:18:56,910 --> 00:18:58,860 But again, just be careful you don't have 486 00:18:58,860 --> 00:19:00,450 to peel back much in the pilot. 487 00:19:00,450 --> 00:19:02,730 You can just hint at it or even not at all. 488 00:19:02,730 --> 00:19:06,030 But for Hopper for instance, two lines at the end of the pilot. 489 00:19:06,030 --> 00:19:09,900 Oh, someone says he lost his kid. 490 00:19:09,900 --> 00:19:11,760 Thanks for coming out teach. 491 00:19:11,760 --> 00:19:12,870 We really appreciate it. 492 00:19:15,456 --> 00:19:17,286 She died a few years back. 493 00:19:17,290 --> 00:19:18,280 Sorry. 494 00:19:18,280 --> 00:19:20,130 His kid. 495 00:19:20,130 --> 00:19:21,230 That's it. 496 00:19:21,230 --> 00:19:22,400 We know there's more to him. 497 00:19:22,403 --> 00:19:24,073 And we're going to go into that further, 498 00:19:24,070 --> 00:19:26,680 but we're just hinting that there's more beneath this 499 00:19:26,680 --> 00:19:28,470 and just like right just a cop. 500 00:19:28,465 --> 00:19:34,335 [MUSIC PLAYING] 501 00:19:34,336 --> 00:19:36,906 The other important thing, right, and I've 502 00:19:36,910 --> 00:19:40,750 touched on this a little bit is that these characters are 503 00:19:40,750 --> 00:19:41,720 going to surprise you. 504 00:19:41,720 --> 00:19:44,560 So they are kind of living, breathing things. 505 00:19:44,560 --> 00:19:46,810 I think if you've created a good character, 506 00:19:46,810 --> 00:19:48,850 and what's going to happen is and you 507 00:19:48,847 --> 00:19:50,677 have to stay true to their character, right? 508 00:19:50,680 --> 00:19:53,020 So as we said there's going to be a drive, 509 00:19:53,020 --> 00:19:55,540 and you're going to throw obstacles in their path. 510 00:19:55,540 --> 00:19:59,350 And you're going to kind of a little bit watch 511 00:19:59,350 --> 00:20:03,140 how these characters are going to overcome that obstacle. 512 00:20:03,137 --> 00:20:04,717 And I think if you're doing something, 513 00:20:04,720 --> 00:20:06,910 and it's not organic to who they are as a character, 514 00:20:06,910 --> 00:20:08,410 it's going to be pretty obvious it's 515 00:20:08,410 --> 00:20:09,710 going to feel really wrong. 516 00:20:09,710 --> 00:20:11,980 And so oftentimes, this is what's 517 00:20:11,980 --> 00:20:16,310 cool about writing is they become very real in a sense. 518 00:20:16,307 --> 00:20:17,887 Because you don't want to manufacture. 519 00:20:17,890 --> 00:20:19,100 You don't want to force them. 520 00:20:19,098 --> 00:20:21,638 They're going to kind of a little bit do their own thing. 521 00:20:21,640 --> 00:20:25,690 And what's fun about that is they can often surprise you. 522 00:20:25,690 --> 00:20:31,310 [MUSIC PLAYING] 523 00:20:31,306 --> 00:20:33,386 So hopefully in your blue sky and you've 524 00:20:33,390 --> 00:20:35,970 come up with some possible characters 525 00:20:35,973 --> 00:20:38,643 that you want that you think you need to tell the story that you 526 00:20:38,640 --> 00:20:40,180 want to inhabit this world. 527 00:20:40,180 --> 00:20:44,430 So you're going to make a list now of possible characters. 528 00:20:44,430 --> 00:20:47,220 This is a good something that we did and you saw us do, 529 00:20:47,220 --> 00:20:48,520 and it can be really helpful. 530 00:20:48,520 --> 00:20:49,470 You're going to make a list. 531 00:20:49,470 --> 00:20:51,120 You can come up with names if you want. 532 00:20:51,120 --> 00:20:53,040 Just pick three to five that you think 533 00:20:53,040 --> 00:20:54,960 are necessary to tell this story. 534 00:20:54,960 --> 00:20:56,670 And then start to flesh them out. 535 00:20:56,670 --> 00:20:59,150 Don't do that for all the characters just some of them. 536 00:20:59,153 --> 00:21:00,823 You have an idea that pops in your head. 537 00:21:00,820 --> 00:21:02,990 Oh here's a good idea for an arc for this character. 538 00:21:02,987 --> 00:21:03,747 Jot it down. 539 00:21:03,750 --> 00:21:06,150 Or just say this is Lucas. 540 00:21:06,150 --> 00:21:06,780 He's a nerd. 541 00:21:06,780 --> 00:21:07,500 He wears black. 542 00:21:07,500 --> 00:21:09,420 He has glasses. 543 00:21:09,420 --> 00:21:10,380 He gets bullied. 544 00:21:10,380 --> 00:21:12,060 It can be that basic. 545 00:21:12,060 --> 00:21:14,020 But just come up with that initial list. 546 00:21:14,020 --> 00:21:16,170 And I think it's going to be really helpful as you 547 00:21:16,170 --> 00:21:19,400 move forward to the next stage of writing.