[Orna] Suddenly, like, the...
enormity of their stories just, like, is sitting with me-
-[Virginia] Mm-hm. -[Orna] Like, in a...
I- I don't know, it feels like I need a lot of...
heart and head space to kind of hold it all
-and like- -[Virginia] Absolutely.
[Orna] do something with it, and...
really overwhelming sense of responsibility.
♪airy ambient music♪
[Orna] What are your plans with the pregnancy?
-I don't know. -Yeah.
I think we're gonna wait a good while.
-[Orna] Mm-hm. -Yeah.
it's- it's gonna...
it's gonna be a bit.
I think we-
I think we wanna sit-
[Orna] Mm-hm.
and enjoy where we're at-
-Just- -for a little bit.
Let the freakin' dust settle. [laughs]
-Yeah. -Yeah.
Yeah, and- and kind of play it by ear.
Where are you, Sarah?
I think I'm still dealing with, like, a little bit of...
I don't even know, honestly.
Confliction, guilt,
or feeling like I should feel differently.
[sniffs]
[sighs]
I think I just felt so much conviction about it.
-Mm-hm. -[Sarah] And I felt so ready.
And I felt...
like, uh...
[crying] it was all gonna happen.
And...this is great where we're at,
I'm super-excited and I'm super-proud of us
-for doing this work. -[Orna] Mm-hm.
But it still feels a little bit like loss, somehow.
[Orna] Of course.
[sniffs]
I think I am...
mourning this, uh- [scoffs]
like, heteronormative way of getting pregnant?
Yeah.
And I don't think I've ever felt
-envy like that before. -[Orna] Yeah.
Where it's rage-
-[Orna] Mm-hm. -but quieter. [laughs]
And...
-really ugly- -[Orna] Yeah.
-and really... -[Orna] Yeah, a very
particular color.
-Uh-huh. -[Orna] Mm-hm.
Um- [sighs]
and I think I'm just mourning that that's not an option-
-[Orna] Yeah. -for us.
-Mm-hm. -[Sarah] And I think,
for so long, I assumed...
-a hetero life- -Mm-hm.
[Sarah] And, um...
that it would be this sort of surprise of like,
"Oh, my god, we got pregnant.
-How did this happen? -[Orna] Mm-hm.
It's crazy." [laughs]
Um, and just that it has to be so...
-[Orna] Intentional. -Intentional.
-[Orna] Mm-hm. -I think that's-
and- I- I love intentionality.
-[Orna] Mm-hm. -But this is the one thing
that I'm like,
-"Motherfucker- [laughs] -[Orna] Mm-hm.
Why? Why this?
This sucks."
-Any- any- -[Lauren] Yeah.
thoughts? Reaction?
I do feel a bit of guilt
in the relief...
in a certain way that I have.
Like, "Oh, like, now we do get to, like,
-have a little more time- -[Orna] Mm-hm.
here in this really...
like, lovely time period that we're in."
We planned, like, three trips-
-[Lauren] Yeah. -like, right after we found out
-we didn't get pregnant. -[Orna] Mm-hm.
We were like, "Okay, so we're going to Italy next summer."
-[laughs] Like- -[Orna] Mm-hm.
Like, it's gonna be-
like, I'm really excited
-for the next few years. -I am, too.
On the intentionality piece of it,
that doesnt really affect me as much, I guess.
It's frustrating that it's going to be, like,
a medical procedure that, like, you're gonna have to go under.
And that's- that's really scary.
But...
like, at the same time,
I felt like I've known that for a really long time
and I've accepted it-
Would you feel differently, though,
if it was your body?
I mean, I've gone through plenty of
surgeries at this point.
I don't think it really phases me anymore.
At this point, I'm kind of like,
"Oh, that's part of the journey."
[laughs] You're right.
[laughs] Like, right, it's like,
"Oh, major life change? Surgery.
-Yeah. -You're gonna get-
-Great! -You're getting married?
Oh, so you're going in for surgery?" [laughs]
Yeah, [laughs] I- I assume there's some
surgical component of this.
[laughter]
Yeah.
And now, we're coming up
on two years of marriage in January.
Yeah.
-And five years together. -I know.
-It's pretty good! -[Orna] Mm-hm.
That's not nothin'.
-[Orna] That's not nothin'. -No.
♪soft emotional music♪
There's, like, this.
[inaudible]
♪♪♪
Yeah, it's, like,
humans aren't made to live in New York.
It does weird things to you.
You walk into the subway and someone's, like,
on the ground, and, like,
your first instinct is to walk over them?
[Sarah] I know.
♪♪♪
[Orna] The kind of...
dilemmas or conflicts that couples have...
-most of them, I relate to. -[Virginia] Right.
[Orna] I've been on one side or...
both sides of the conflict myself.
I mean most of the time it doesnt feel like,
"Oh, I don't understand what they're talking about."
I know what they're talking about 'cause I've been there.
♪♪♪
[Orna] Do you...
wish that Evelyn said...
"I really wanna try to work on this?"
Yeah.
[Orna] How would you feel if she said,
"I really wanna work on this"?
I would be a 110 percent willing to do that.
[Orna] Mm-hm.
[Orna] I'm teetering back and forth between feeling like,
"Of course they should break up-"
[Virginia] Yup.
and feeling like,
"What am I, crazy?
-The- I- I- I- -[Virginia] Mm.
I should help them give it another real try."
A real shot.
And why did you feel...
you shouldn't give up on them when they were giving up?
Because I felt like they're both ambivalent
and I was siding with the giving up.
I feel like I have a lot of power over them.
So, when I...
orient towards...
"Try it," they're like, "Okay-
-Yeah. -We're going with you."
-Yeah. -Like, they're- they're like-
Yeah.
[Orna] Um...
so that's a little scary.
You know, he took on the role in the couple of, like,
the one that hides and conceals
-and is kind of evasive. -[Virginia] Yeah.
[Orna] Because he always feels like he's failing her.
She didn't understand his resentment until
he was able to finally say to her...
how much he is working to please her.
I think that made a change for her.
So, I don't know how this is gonna play out.
-[Orna] Hi. -[both] Hi.
[laughs]
[Orna] How are you two?
-Good. -We're good.
We've been communicating more.
We've been, um-
like, we try to meditate as often as possible.
-[Orna] You do? -Yeah, yeah, yeah.
-To get, yeah- -We've been- we've been-
she got me into it.
-[Orna] Oh! -Yeah. [laughs]
And we've been, um...
doing it together.
Yeah.
[Alan] So, we've been, like, following, like,
kind of like a reprogramming kind of it-
-Breaking the patterns of- -Yeah, breaking patterns
and trying to, like...
kind of like move-
like, "let go of the past," like...
kind of stuff.
-Just trying to- -Try- trying to break
bad habits- [laughter]
-Wow. -[Alan] that, yeah, may be
affecting us.
I, uh...
I feel like what you mentioned...
last week about...
the difference in our approaches.
Like...
what she's trying to build on, I'm-
I'm going reverse or-
-Mm-hm. -[Alan] doing this dance
-and I was like- -Yeah.
You know, I think I had just...
helped me...
step back and reflect.
And, like, you know, putting myself in the very position
that I don't want to be in by the way I'm doing things.
-[Orna] Mm-hm. -So-
Meaning you're weakening
-the relationship. -[Alan] Correct.
And then, you're looking at it and you're saying,
"It looks weak."
[Alan] Yeah.
And, like, it's just, like...
you know, a-
-a vicious cycle- -Mm-hm.
where it's like I'm never-
-"I can't trust it." -[Alan] Yeah.
I'm not even-
So, I'm not even giving her an opportunity...
-or for us to, like- -[Orna] Yes.
-get something right- -[Orna] Yes.
-because I'm so standoffish- -[Orna] Right.
about the way things have been.
That's big.
-So- -No, that's huge.
-Um- -[Orna] Mm-hm.
I've noticed the change
even in him from last week.
Just-
you know, just him being more open to...
like, listening to me, and...
I don't think he realized, like, how-
how that was really happening.
[Orna] Ho- how guarded-
-How guarded he was. -[Orna] Alans been, yeah.
Yeah- no, no, I-
-You know- -I didn't. I just-
-Yeah. -It's- it's almost like I put
-blame on her- -[Orna] Yeah.
and I've been, like, defensive towards her.
So almost like...
I- maybe in... some ways
I felt like I made up my mind.
Like, maybe I didn't want to go.
I didn't want to save...
-the relationship. -[Orna] Mm-hm.
J- it's the same thing with me,
-you know? -[Orna] Mm-hm.
Whenever I would feel like anything had to do with trust,
I would go back and think about
the times that he's done these things to me where...
I felt like,
"Well, this is an example of why I can't trust you.
Like, out of all these things,"
-you know. -[Orna] Mm-hm. Yeah.
[Evelyn] Not realizing that I'm actually triggering Alan
to, like, more stress.
You know, I do...
want us to move forward and I-
You know, I would like to take things...
a step at a time.
Like, I- I just don't want to make any more...
rash decisions...
with us...
anymore.
[Evelyn] Neither do I.
I love you. You know that.
-I'm learning more about that. -[laughs]
♪slow acoustic strumming♪
[Orna] People do better with the truth
than without it.
People underestimate themselves and...
spend unnecessary energy protecting themselves
from truths
that they fear will kill them.
And actually will make them stronger
and make them happier.
♪♪♪
People want to do better.
It's not very difficult to find underneath the...
heavy...
crust of, like, resentment and fight to-
to find...
the wish to repair and the wish to love.
♪♪♪
[Virginia] We're very highly confident when people come
and sit down on that couch
that between all our techniques and our life of wisdom...
[Orna] We can find the solution.
[Virginia] Yeah, we could find the solutions, but-
-[Orna] It's not always true. -not always.
-[Orna] Yeah. -Absolutely, not always.
[Orna] Yeah.
Couples come to us, almost always,
when they're in the middle of a crisis.
There- so, there is a sense of emergency and urgency.
With individuals, you don't have the feeling
like "If I don't get this right now-
-Mm-hm. -[Virginia] there'll be
a catastrophe."
But that's not true in couples work.
If I don't get that right now,
-there could be a catastrophe. -Right.
[Virginia] They could break up when they shouldn't-
Right. Right.
[Virginia] Because I wasn't fast enough
to see a certain something.
You know, one couple dropped out?
Annie and Mau?
♪groovy music♪
[Annie] "Cardigans for your comfort."
That should be, um-
that should be a- a thing. [laughs]
[Orna] When they decided to quit early, it-
it was like a continuation of how I felt
with them all along.
Which is...
always one step behind.
They're- they're...
symbiotic.
They complete each others sentences.
They don't have to even say one word
and they know what each other are thinking.
They've already had an argument,
like, the whole argument, in two words.
And I'm like,
"What just happened?" [laughs]
Can the two of you explain that to me?
-[Annie] No. -[laughs]
Wh-...
No.
[Orna] If she really wanted to leave,
she doesnt need his permission.
She doesnt need him to understand
that she needs to leave. She would just leave.
♪♪♪
It's funny because it looks like he has so much control,
right? Hes so...
domineering on the surface.
But she has all the power in there to decide.
♪♪♪
And it's up to her whether she's gonna grow in the relationship,
or if she's gonna have to, like...
break out.
♪♪♪
♪quiet emotional music♪
You know, your partner always...
pauses a certain challenge to you
of, like...
there's another way of seeing things.
♪♪♪
But tha- that's like a constant irritant.
Accumulating a long history with someone,
like, really knowing them...
and finding a way to continue loving them...
despite whatever comes your way
that might...
make it difficult for you.
I mean, there's enormous growth and beauty in that.
♪♪♪
-Hello. -[unintelligible]
[Elaine] How are you?
-[Desean] Hey. -[Orna] Hi.
[Elaine] [unintelligible]
I never told you something, actually,
when Desean and I met.
We work together.
And...
someone at the job was telling me
how cute Desean was.
And...
I was like, "Oh, my god, yeah,
he's so good-looking."
And, um...
we met.
And I felt...
like, this thing in my stomach
and this whole reaction...
-to me. -[Orna] Mm-hm.
[Elaine] And I was like, "Oh, my god"
-in my head. -Mm-hm.
At the time, I was married.
[Orna] Mm-hm.
I went home to my then-husband.
I was like, "I met this guy.
Oh, my goodness, he's so great
and he's so fanta-..."
Not-
-not realizing- -[Orna] Not knowing
what you're saying.
Not be- but it wa-
it just struck me the way that it did.
It wasn't like, "Oh, my god, I'm gonna marry him."
That- that- it was just here-
I...felt him.
And, uh, so I need to...
m- make that a constant for me.
How are you doing?
She is very in-tune with...me.
[Orna] Mm-hm.
But the funny thing is...
I- I don't understand why we...
constantly get into the disagreements
-or these ar- -Well, I-
I have some thoughts about it.
But I'm actually more curious to know
what do you guys think?
I mean, based on what we've done here...
It comes from the lack of trust.
Not really y-
[Orna] From your lack of trust.
Correct.
Not really toward you,
but just in general.
And so, like she said,
my- my-
my pictures are painted with these colors.
-[Orna] Mm-hm. -Right?
And so-
but I've developed new colors.
So, I'm excited about that.
But the part that is yours, yes,
it has to do with your mistrust.
[Elaine] Mm-hm.
And that you project that on.
[clears throat]
But there's a part that is yours, Desean,
that we'r- we didn't do enough work with.
You are...
extremely, full-heartedly committed...
-to Elaine, right? -Yes.
[Orna] You're there. You're solid.
-You're- you're there. -Yeah.
[Orna] But you have parts of you that are...
more tucked away-
[Desean] Yeah.
The way you kind of manage your anger.
And it comes out, it leaks out
in all sorts of ways...
that...
-trigger, Elaine. -Yeah.
[Orna] So, it's not just Elaine's projections.
-Hmm. -[Orna] It- it's parts of you
that you don't... completely own...
that have the affect on the two of you, too.
Coming into this...
I-
I wanted-
I wanted us to have this- this therapy.
But I wanted it more for you, right?
I felt, coming into this...
I- I don't have, you know,
major issues and it's all her and...
she'll see once we get in there and-
-[Orna] Mm-hm. -we start talking about
this stuff. But...
there was a- a major turning point for me
that, uh...
allowed me to...
get rid of all of the, um...
the resentment and- and...
ill will that I came in...
um, for her.
-Damn. Ill will. -Uh, uh, it was-
it- yeah, it- it was at one point where...
just one day before, I was ready to...
call it quits and "I'm done."
And then, the next day,
through, you know, the sessions,
um...
I had this sort of...
realization that...
I said to her- I said to her-
I said, "You need to listen to me right now.
You- the- the words that are about to come out of my mouth,
you- you need to really listen."
And- and it had to do with her trusting me.
And letting her know that I...
got you.
And I'm- yeah, I'm-
So, you know, I'm gonna leave...
you know, um...
going forward with the feeling that...
we're unbreakable, you know.
-Nothing can come between us. -[laughs]
It's, you know...
And that's a good place to be.
[Orna] Mm-hm.
Yeah.
♪soft emotional music♪
[Orna] I mean, sometimes you get to witness people
just really...
transcend.
Like they- they just kind of...
you know, phoenix rising.
That they just find this, like, incredible spirit
and they...
do better than the cards they were dealt.
♪♪♪
[Alan] Bye.
♪♪♪
-Take care. -[Orna] Take care.
Thank you so much.
♪♪♪
[sighs]
[kiss]
-[Elaine] [laughs] -Thank you so much.
Appreciate everything youve done for us.
Thank you so much.
I appreciate you.
Thank you.
I appreciate you sincerely.
Thank you.
♪♪♪
[Orna] We know each other. We care about each other.
[Virginia] Yeah.
[Orna] But we know that this relationship is not...
gonna be there later once it's over.
You have to say goodbye and- and you have no...
claim.
That they go on with their lives.
[Virginia] Yeah.
And I'm like-
-I'm left with- -[Virginia] Well-
a none-
-[Virginia] Yeah. -with a void that they leave.
[Virginia] Yeah.
you will turn out to be another thing
that happened in their lives.
Yeah.
And they are...
-the whole and only thing. -Yes.
-[Virginia] That was it. -Yeah.
Yeah.
It's such a bizarre profession.
So bizarre. [scoffs]
[Virginia] Mm-hm.
♪airy synths♪
-Hi. -[Adeline] Adeline.
Chris.
-Hi. -Hi.
[Jessica] Hi, I'm Jessica.
-Jessica. -[Jessica] Pleased to meet you.
Aww.
-Hello. -Hi.
-[laughs] Hi. -How are you?
-Hi. -Hi.
Christine, Aaron?
-Yeah. -Yes.
[Orna] Come in.
-[Christine] How are you? -[Orna] Hi, I'm Orna.
So...
talk to me.
♪I'm just noise♪
♪To your finely pierced ears♪
♪Oh I'm just the other thing that once brought you to tears♪
♪You wanted me to love you now you got that♪
♪Oh it's a bore♪
♪Want me to adore you now you got that♪
♪But you never wanted more♪
♪No, I won't be there when it comes time♪
♪That you want me to stay ♪
♪Well, I'll move♪
♪Yeah, I'll move♪
♪'Cause I'm not moved anymore♪
♪Yeah, you push♪
♪And I pull♪
♪'Til we're in pieces on the floor♪
♪Yeah, I'll move♪
♪I'll move on♪
♪When I'm not moved anymore♪
♪'Cause you won't know what love is♪
♪Until you've touched me♪